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So I am supposed to dilute my 100 mg/ml nic for better storage?
- Thread starter joeyboy
- Start date
Nope.
Ditto!
You can dilute it but only for safety, so that you won't have to handle it many times at high concentration.
AndriaD
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Nope; it's much easier to store highly-concentrated. When you take a bottle out of the freezer, suppose you could dilute it then, if you like, but I find it very easy to use in 100mg form; I'm down to 4mg, but I just use 1ml syringes, makes measuring small amounts very simple. Whatever I take out of the freezer, I keep in the fridge until the bottle is done.
Andria
Andria
I just use it at 100 mg and put what I need. I am at 0.75 mg and went up a little on my last batch of juice. I don't use a lot in a 250 ml nic base bottle.
I need to recalculate what I have. I am unsure if I need more. I estimate about 2 liters in the freezer. I am sure it will go bad before I can use it and you probably won't be able to buy any nic by then.
I need to recalculate what I have. I am unsure if I need more. I estimate about 2 liters in the freezer. I am sure it will go bad before I can use it and you probably won't be able to buy any nic by then.
AndriaD
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If it's in glass in the freezer, it's good for at least 10 yrs, maybe indefinitely. I have about 2.5 liters in the freezer, which should be more than I'll need for the rest of my life -- I'm 55, so if I live another 30 yrs, I'm good with that and have no need to live longer. But I might get another half liter, just in case quitting smoking causes the female longevity that's so common in my family, living to ~100 yrs.
Andria
I have some nic that's been in the freezer for something like 4 years now and it looks the same as it did going in. I didn't test the potency but going by what others have stated who have had their nic in a freezer even longer than I have, any loss should be negligible.
I do not think 10 years is accurate. Can you offer a source for that claim?
AndriaD
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My name ain't google. I've seen someone say that, don't know where, when, or whom. People have been vaping for pretty close to 10 yrs now, and probably some have had nic stored that long, or close to it. But the thing is... I *have* seen claims of 4, 5, 6 yrs storage, with ZERO change in the nic's color, taste, or smell; there might be *slight* degradation in potency, but at 100mg, any slight degradation would be a non-issue. If it can last that long with zero change, it can probably last twice that or even longer, when stored in a freezer in dark glass with little airspace at the top of the bottle.
Andria
Ya, that's what I thought. Just anecdotal nothings. Wishful thinking, which obviously I also wish were true. But that doesn't seem to be the case unfortunately. It's probably, though, something you shouldn't just throw out there as if it were a fact...
When PG and VG only have a 2 and 1 year shelf life, respectively, I think you might need to adjust your expectations for just how long those 2.5 liters in your freezer will last you.
https://www.nudenicotine.com/storing-nicotine-solution/ (further down the article)
AndriaD
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Well then that means that all Nicotine has a shelf life of max 2 years since the base in 100 mg is 90%
And a freezer doesn't magically make things last forever.
Ok, I'm done here. I was just curious if you had something other than anecdotal claims you've come across on the internet. I've got my answer.
Just one of the reasons this FDA shit is such a stresser.
As far as I'm aware, there haven't been any long term studies done on how the type of nic we vapers use ages over the years. So, at least to my standards, there are a lot of unknowns regarding just how long the nic in our freezers will last.
good I thought I missed something I have yet to see any long term test in fact I have never heard anyone mention the current longest period they have been storing Nic and tested any degradation
Oh, and to the OP's question, Nude's article I posted suggests that at least for long term storage, it wouldn't be a bad idea to dilute 100mg down:
"Higher nicotine strengths will possess more nicotine molecules, less likely to be completely solvated by their carrier (PG/VG). Put simply – 100mg/mL formulations will keep for less time than a 24mg/mL formulation."
Should that be taken as gospel? And how long is the "less time" being referenced?
I personally don't dilute my 100mg nic down, but since I have a little ejuice business I go through nic somewhat fast (about a gallon a year at this point). That article did push me to switch from 100% VG to 100% PG as my base of choice, since:
"PG is also a much better solvent for this purpose – it has an extremely low viscosity, will dissipate dispersed oxygen bubbles quickly (say that 4 times fast!), and has a longer shelf-life chemically (2 years from DOM, vs. VG – 1 year)."
But again, there are so many variables involved, it's hard to know how big a difference any of this makes, when speaking in general terms.
"Higher nicotine strengths will possess more nicotine molecules, less likely to be completely solvated by their carrier (PG/VG). Put simply – 100mg/mL formulations will keep for less time than a 24mg/mL formulation."
Should that be taken as gospel? And how long is the "less time" being referenced?
I personally don't dilute my 100mg nic down, but since I have a little ejuice business I go through nic somewhat fast (about a gallon a year at this point). That article did push me to switch from 100% VG to 100% PG as my base of choice, since:
"PG is also a much better solvent for this purpose – it has an extremely low viscosity, will dissipate dispersed oxygen bubbles quickly (say that 4 times fast!), and has a longer shelf-life chemically (2 years from DOM, vs. VG – 1 year)."
But again, there are so many variables involved, it's hard to know how big a difference any of this makes, when speaking in general terms.
I figure there has to be at least a few scientifically minded vapers out there, who have dated bottles stored away in their freezer, with plans to do some tests at various intervals. Hopefully I'll come across their reports at some point.
There are and you can find at least one such discussion over on another forum. That particular thread features a fairly well know vaping advocate and actual chemist who has pretty much said exactly what Andria mentioned.
Thanks! Something to go on (and an actually reason to check out that other forum lol).
I do have some that is two years old and I can't tell a difference. No taste and still clear. It's like eggs, they are still good past expiration date. People put too much thought in to it.
I can see it now, hordes of people running in to tobacco fields stealing leafs to make their own nic. What a thought.
I can see it now, hordes of people running in to tobacco fields stealing leafs to make their own nic. What a thought.
I can comfortably say that the nic I have recently opened, that was in my regular freezer that is part of my fridge, after 2+ years is still clear and having tested it, has not lost strength. That's good enough for me, at this point. Even if it were 90mg, clear and had no change in odor, I'd still use mine.
and thats not even a deep freeze .. pretty good results ... if I can get two + years , sounds good!
As a general rule of thumb, I don't take anything as "gospel" that I am told by a vendor trying to sell me something.
I have looked into the question of nic storage a bit, and somehow I was left with the 10 yr. figure in my mind. No, I didn't bookmark the source, and if called on the carpet would have to admit that it's just my opinion. And I keep in mind that this is a forum of peoples opinions, not a scientific journal. If I have a different opinion, I'll state it, but refrain from telling others what they should or should not say or demand that they provide some sort of proof.
Sure, approach things however you want. But my post brought people in to share their own personal experiences, and point to another source of information, making this thread much more information rich than it was before.
In my experience, it's better to state a higher standard and risk offending someone, than just let things stay murky. Seems to have worked out ok in this thread.
AndriaD
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I'm pretty sure that's where I read it, but it's been so long, I have no specific memory of it. If nic can last 6yrs wtihout significant oxidation or degradation (which I have DEFINITELY read), I see no reason why that would suddenly change at some later point -- any changes are going to be very minute and over a very long span of time.
Andria
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Right, and my approach is to not arbitrarily set a standard and then try to impose it on others. But that's just my choice and opinion...
i just bought 100,g/ml vg base and am confused on how to break it down to 6 or 3 mg is it 1 mg per ml or what?
gopher_byrd
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Like Andria, I leave my nic uncut and just add what is needed to my mix to make it come in at 3 mg. Use a DIY calculator, it will tell you how much of everything is needed to make your recipe. There are lots of good ones out there, Windows based, web based, or Android based. Not sure about IOS or MacOS as I'm not an Apple user.
I agree, using an eliquid calculator will take the guesswork out of mixing nic, and flavorings.
1ml of 100mg per ml, no, don't do that.
Based on 5ml, 6mg is 0.5ml 10mg of 6mg is 0.6ml, and so on. Use a juice calculator, don't mess around with your nic.
AndriaD
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You don't, unless you have a freezer the size of your house -- you store it in 100mg form, and add what you need to each mix, using an ejuice calculator, as everyone else is pointing out. I use this one: DIY E-Liquid Calculator Ten Flavors With Nicotine Plus PG/VG Adjusting.
If it's in VG, it'll need to be out of the freezer for a bit before mixing, or it's more of a gel than a liquid. I keep a 30ml bottle in the fridge, for use in mixing, but mine's PG, so it stays thin -- for nic in VG, might want to keep a smallish bottle out of the freezer/fridge, on the counter, in the cabinet, etc -- dark glass, dark or dim storage.
Andria
For better storage no, for safer handling yes.