Become a Patron!
Liquid nicotine needs stricter regulation, state says
- Thread starter 5150sick
- Start date
My parents raised me better than that. I pay my taxes.I didn't ask you to pay a dime. Feel free to quit paying anytime you like.
No your parents were brain washed that the tax code is viable and legal. Which it is not.
That's what the corrupt government counts on. Keep up the good work.
As I said, personally I see no value in feeding an immoral, unethical and corrupt institution. It certainly won't make me moral or ethical to do so. I'd just have a lighter wallet.
To each their own though. I hope it works out for you.
Its also what people like you count on as well... using the services and not paying your part. You are worse than the illegals you complain about.
For not minding the tax you pay, you sure seem resentful for having to pay it. Who uses the "services" is not up to me. Who pays for it is not up to me. Those are government decisions. You give the government permission to make them and your money is used the way the government says it will be used.
There is no reason to blame me for what the government does with your money and there is no reason to blame me because you pay and I don't. When you have a government that does not give my money to people, countries and things that I don't agree with, I might choose to support it financially. Until then, giving the government my money would be the same as giving it to a drug addict for food knowing he will buy more drugs with it. I ain't doing it.
There is no need for you to resent me for not paying for things I don't want.
You seriously cant be this ignorant, can you?
Do you like what the government spends your money on?
If the Founding Fathers had believed they should just pay their taxes, we would still be under British rule.
Do you think I should pay, regardless that I don't agree with how it's spent?
I do drive on the roads and I do pay gas tax and property tax for that.
What else do you think I need to pay for?
This isnt some conspiracy against e cig users...Its a tax other business's pay already to sell cigarettes or beer or chewing tobacco or whatever else falls under ATF regulation bull shit.
Were not going to stop the tax no matter how much we rebel or protest or complain about it.
We should consider ourselves lucky its not a full on ban of anything vape wise and can get us tickets or jail time to have it in our possesion.
people are already paying stupid prices for e juice b4 this tax so whats 40 percent tax on the price...40 cents more on the dollar?
So now the $5.00 dollar 10ml bottle of juice is $7.00...are we really that broke?..Maybe some will stop screwing people with the rediculous prices they charge and make it so its affordable with the tax included.
Were not going to stop the tax no matter how much we rebel or protest or complain about it.
We should consider ourselves lucky its not a full on ban of anything vape wise and can get us tickets or jail time to have it in our possesion.
people are already paying stupid prices for e juice b4 this tax so whats 40 percent tax on the price...40 cents more on the dollar?
So now the $5.00 dollar 10ml bottle of juice is $7.00...are we really that broke?..Maybe some will stop screwing people with the rediculous prices they charge and make it so its affordable with the tax included.
$2 is a big deal.
I only vape 5ml a day. A $2 difference in price equals $365 per year.
So, if we word the tax different, we can call it a $365 fee for permission from the government to buy ejuice for one year. Worded like that, it doesn't sound so cheap, does it? And the fee only goes up for those that vape more.
The other business' did not pay the tax. The people buying the products did.
And just because they fucked us on other tobacco products is a poor excuse to bend over for it now, IMO.
I'm definately opposed to paying the government $365 a year to vape.
I only vape 5ml a day. A $2 difference in price equals $365 per year.
So, if we word the tax different, we can call it a $365 fee for permission from the government to buy ejuice for one year. Worded like that, it doesn't sound so cheap, does it? And the fee only goes up for those that vape more.
The other business' did not pay the tax. The people buying the products did.
And just because they fucked us on other tobacco products is a poor excuse to bend over for it now, IMO.
I'm definately opposed to paying the government $365 a year to vape.
Last edited:
5150sick
Under Ground Hustler
Staff member
VU Administrator
Senior Moderator
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
Press Corps
Member For 5 Years
Mod Team Leader
"Provides for the suspension or revocation of a manufacturer's permit and the assessment of a civil penalty against a manufacturer for a violation of the law. Provides that a retailer who knowingly: (1) sells e-liquid to a minor; (2) sells e-liquid purchased from a manufacturer that does not have a permit; or (3) sells e-liquid that has been altered or tampered with; commits a Class C infraction. Makes other unauthorized actions involving e-liquid a Class A infraction. Authorizes a permit holder to bring a civil action against an e-liquid producer that distributes e-liquid not approved for sale in Indiana."
You guys do realize that most eliquid people in Indiana use is made in one of the OTHER 49 states right?
Looks like if you live in Indiana then the B&M's can only carry Indiana eliquid.
So no one sees this as a problem for the industry?
Don't fucking kid yourselves! if this passes and you live in Indiana you are fucked!
"Establishes manufacturing requirements, including the use of child proof caps on e-liquid containers; the performance of all mixing, bottling, and packaging activities in a "clean room"; the storage of all e-liquid ingredients in a secure area; and the maintenance of three sample bottles from each production batch for at least three years. Limits the ingredients that can be used in making e-liquid."
Limits the ingredients that can be used in making e-liquid.???
Like say, child friendly flavors?
All flavors besides tobacco and menthol?
"Limits the ingredients that can be used in making e-liquid." means if you live in indiana you are totally fucked!
Don't get it twisted and think otherwise! - 5150
You guys do realize that most eliquid people in Indiana use is made in one of the OTHER 49 states right?
Looks like if you live in Indiana then the B&M's can only carry Indiana eliquid.
So no one sees this as a problem for the industry?
Don't fucking kid yourselves! if this passes and you live in Indiana you are fucked!
"Establishes manufacturing requirements, including the use of child proof caps on e-liquid containers; the performance of all mixing, bottling, and packaging activities in a "clean room"; the storage of all e-liquid ingredients in a secure area; and the maintenance of three sample bottles from each production batch for at least three years. Limits the ingredients that can be used in making e-liquid."
Limits the ingredients that can be used in making e-liquid.???
Like say, child friendly flavors?
All flavors besides tobacco and menthol?
"Limits the ingredients that can be used in making e-liquid." means if you live in indiana you are totally fucked!
Don't get it twisted and think otherwise! - 5150
5150sick
Under Ground Hustler
Staff member
VU Administrator
Senior Moderator
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
Press Corps
Member For 5 Years
Mod Team Leader
Did any of you naysayers even bother to READ the bill in it's current form?
https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2015/bills/senate/539#digest-heading
https://iga.in.gov/legislative/2015/bills/senate/539#digest-heading
5150sick
Under Ground Hustler
Staff member
VU Administrator
Senior Moderator
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
Press Corps
Member For 5 Years
Mod Team Leader
Sec. 3. (a) Except as otherwise permitted by this article, a person22may not purchase, receive, manufacture, import, or transport, or23cause to be imported or transported from another state, territory,24or country into Indiana, or transport, ship, barter, give away,25exchange, furnish, or otherwise handle or dispose of e-liquid, or to26possess e-liquid for purpose of sale.27(b) A person may not knowingly receive or acquire e-liquid28from a person or authorized distributor who does not hold a valid29permit under this article to sell, deliver, furnish, or give the30e-liquid.31(c) A person who violates this section commits a Class A32infraction.33Sec. 4. (a) A permittee may bring a civil action against any:34(1) producer of e-liquid
5150sick
Under Ground Hustler
Staff member
VU Administrator
Senior Moderator
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
Press Corps
Member For 5 Years
Mod Team Leader
"bottling services, or both services.However, both the manufacturer performing a service under clause and the manufacturer for which the service is performed must meet the requirements of this chapter. The manufacturer or anyone having a financial interest in a manufacturer may not have been convicted of a felony or an offense involving a controlled substance.
Got caught smoking a joint 25 years ago when you were 18 yrs old?
Bye, Bye eliquid company!
Got caught smoking a joint 25 years ago when you were 18 yrs old?
Bye, Bye eliquid company!
They won't understand until they reap the consequences me thinks.
When they have a choice between a Vuse or Blu ecig and can't even order cheap chinese juice they'll awaken and wonder what happened.
I doubt they'll read it but I'll put this here; http://gizmodo.com/the-maker-of-blu-e-cigs-is-lobbying-to-ban-vaping-1633442788
When they have a choice between a Vuse or Blu ecig and can't even order cheap chinese juice they'll awaken and wonder what happened.
I doubt they'll read it but I'll put this here; http://gizmodo.com/the-maker-of-blu-e-cigs-is-lobbying-to-ban-vaping-1633442788
Last edited:
5150sick
Under Ground Hustler
Staff member
VU Administrator
Senior Moderator
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
Press Corps
Member For 5 Years
Mod Team Leader
Well hopefully someone in indiana is smart enough to learn how to make e juice and can afford the licensing whos never been convicted of smoking a joint or some other illegal substance....What i see is an opportunity for someone in indiana to become a big business.
From what i can see ,Indiana is just wanting to keep the revenue in Indiana.
What i dont see is them making it so no one could possibly start a legit business under the proposals and make money.
I look around on the internet and see these bottles of ejuice that sell for stupid amounts of money..I dont care how good it tastes..i would never in a million years pay 25 30 dollars for 30ml of e juice when we all know damn well it cost them maybe $1.00 to make....whos screwing who here?...If the price is right it will sell with the added tax..if its not it wont.
In reality id rather know my juice was made in sanitary conditions rather than maybe from some ones home that might have cockroaches running around the house and over juice bottles or syringes....I see regulations for sanitary manufacturing as a plus.
I dont see this as the end of the vaping world in indiana because they want to regulate and tax it...in reality nicotine IS a dangerous drug that can KILL you if youre stupid...were just lucky they arent banning it period...If big tobacco didnt need nicotine it ckild very well be declared an illegal substance...but the government isnt stupid to do that as they make a shit load off it...Now they want more ,so what new really?
Dont get me wrong here,..i would vote no to most proposals as well but its not going to matter..government and state 99.999 percent of the time get what they want and they more than likely will with this proposal in Indiana and any other state seeking the same.
Last edited:
5150sick
Under Ground Hustler
Staff member
VU Administrator
Senior Moderator
VU Donator
Diamond Contributor
Press Corps
Member For 5 Years
Mod Team Leader
Something tells me you will NOT be one of the people that shows up to speak in opposition of this and other bills?
A LOT of bad bills have been defeated by CASAA, Vape Shops, and Vapers who show up in opposition to these type of bills
If everyone had a "what the government wants, the government gets" attitude than vaping would have been banned in 2009 when the FDA tried to call it a drug.
Then we would mostly all be smoking cigarettes or dead right now.
A LOT of bad bills have been defeated by CASAA, Vape Shops, and Vapers who show up in opposition to these type of bills
If everyone had a "what the government wants, the government gets" attitude than vaping would have been banned in 2009 when the FDA tried to call it a drug.
Then we would mostly all be smoking cigarettes or dead right now.
hold on, that is quite the statement right there. you are saying that trying to keep what you earned by voluntary means from people with guns and cages trying to take it from you through force and violence is theft?
wow that is really an ass backwards statement whether you believe in complying with them or not
the only reason taxation is theft is because they use violence to get it. people evading taxes are not stealing anything nor using violence. if people had the choice to pay taxes without the threat of punishment (in other words abiding by the constitution) then it wouldnt be theft.
So?
I'm not allowed to save money by switching to vaping?
I find it interesting that you insist that you know what's best for how much of my own money I get to keep. Why do you insist on volunteering my money to the government? If $352 is nothing to you, let me know. I'll send you my address so you can mail me a check. It's only $1 a day. You apparently don't need it.
No. Tax evasion is theft because we live in a Republic, NOT a anarchy. There have been taxes in this country since the foundation of it.
People fool themselves when they make a statement, about the Revolution being about a tax, or the tea tax. The rebellion was about the TAXES being sent to England.
Um,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,no.
No fed income tax until the civil war. Aug 5, 1861 to be exact. Texas still does not have a income tax.
Apparently, you need to brush up on your history and civics classes.
Apparently, since you have never seen my library, you assume lots, but know little.
I didn't claim income tax was around since the foundation of the country. I said taxes were.
Great for Texas. There are federal taxes due, however. Laws are laws. Because you don't agree with them or like them, doesn't make them any less valid.
Challenge the laws if you think they are unconstitutional.
I didn't claim income tax was around since the foundation of the country. I said taxes were.
Great for Texas. There are federal taxes due, however. Laws are laws. Because you don't agree with them or like them, doesn't make them any less valid.
Challenge the laws if you think they are unconstitutional.
Perhaps you can start researching at the tax codes, of the U.S.
also your argument here is that because everyone is being stolen from, if one stands up for himself to bear the fruits of his labor, he is the thief. am I getting that right?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
so you cannot cite a law requiring citizens to pay the federal government money?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I did. You choose to ignore it, because you think you somehow have undisputed proof being taxed is illegal.
Challenge the government, if you are correct. Otherwise, it's just blowing smoke.
no you didn't. and I'm not saying they honor their laws, similar to pleading your case to a mob. research Irwin schiff and his case
point is the law is voluntary otherwise it would be in direct violation of the constitution and nullified in the Supreme Court assuming the judges are ethical. do your research
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Again, IF the laws are unconstitutional, they would have been struck down eons ago. They ARE valid, and until someone challenges and defeats them, they ARE valid law.
This is a Republic, not a damn anarchy. We are a nation of laws.
the law is voluntary. you just completely skipped over that main point
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
If you were right, how do you explain the Brown's? They found out how "voluntary" the law is.
Skip out paying taxes you owe, and you do REAL prison time. You don't "volunteer" to be put there.....
it's not if I'm right I am 100% right. read the laws then read about Irwin schiff then you might get your mind turning long enough to realize it's mob rule with illusions of freedom built around it
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Because you "feel" the law is wrong, doesn't make you right. I really don't care what Irwin has to say. It's not changing or challenging law. It's an opinion that does nothing productive.
I have ZERO illusions of freedom in this country. We don't have freedom. Even I know that.
The LAW is law, until it is struck down or changed. You opining that it's voluntary is just that. DON'T pay the taxes you owe and you will lose.
oh wow.. come on guys.. thing is.. do you feel it needs to be strict or not??
personally, i already said what I had to say.. but to see my friends at each other this way.. really?
either we unite, or we fall apart.. only one way the other.. now kiss and make up.
personally, i already said what I had to say.. but to see my friends at each other this way.. really?
either we unite, or we fall apart.. only one way the other.. now kiss and make up.
dude... read the law. it directly states paying taxes to the federal government is up to the individual and is voluntary. this is not an opinion by any stretch of the imagination. I repeat this is not an opinion please do your research and read the law because I can tell if you do you'll be open minded enough to take it for what it is.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I'm not at anyone. I merely am expressing what I think and know.
Even I don't agree with the tax laws. But I am realistic enough to know, you either do as the law says, or you suffer the consequences.
Vapers will never unite. There is no movement. How many smokers rallied behind tobacco companies or rallied to stop cigarette taxes?
Won't happen with vaping either. That's just the reality of it.
Even I don't agree with the tax laws. But I am realistic enough to know, you either do as the law says, or you suffer the consequences.
Vapers will never unite. There is no movement. How many smokers rallied behind tobacco companies or rallied to stop cigarette taxes?
Won't happen with vaping either. That's just the reality of it.
So what exactly has stopped you from challenging the law then? If it's voluntary, this should be an easy case for you.
I don't challenge mobs alone. when a large majority understands what I'm trying to tell you here then we will challenge together. but as long as people are willfully ignorant of what the law actually says then we have no chance of breaking free. so I ask you again to please read the law and take in what it says
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Lol. Sunshine patriot? Look, shit tons of people (aka the vast majority) would get behind that movement. NO ONE likes paying a shit load of taxes. But it IS legal, or it would have been struck down LONG ago.
If this were as simple as you say, then there would be NO Federal taxes. However, they are constitutional and they are legal. If you are as educated as you think you are, then you know the Federal government has SPECIFIC duties. What they are required to do, must be funded. Taxes are how it is supposed to be funded.
IF you were right, no one could deny that. Even this "mob" you think is against you. Trust me, NO ONE wants to pay taxes, but it IS necessary.
this isnt a movement, nor is anyone against me personally. this is a fact i am trying to tell you. if you refuse to read the law that no one can deny then there is nothing further to say on that and you willfully accept that you choose to ignore very important information regarding the use of violence by our government against the people.
and yes i do know the federal government a specific duty to uphold a national defense system. which is why there is a tax, but if it were required it would be struck down by the supreme court based on the constitution overriding it. so they had to word it constitutionally by making sure it was voluntary on paper, then they enforce it as if it were required to keep the entire nation paying something they really dont have to. this is not legal, this is putting people in cages for abiding by the law. and that is not an opinion