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Caution at your local vape shop

Stone

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First and foremost I am writing this with the intent to possibly help someone who is newer to the vaping world like myself and to possibly help them from making a bad purchase. We all work hard for our money and we hate to see it pissed away on inferior products. * hopefully this forum section is suitable for this thread *

I am a big believer in supporting our local vape stores verses buying online. For one it saves me time. Second, it puts money into our communities. Third, I don't have to worry about my credit card number being placed online. I'm sure there are more reasons but one gets the idea.
About a week ago I had been wanting to buy a Kanger aerotank. I did my homework online, watched reviews gathered prices ect. Knowing I could buy a clone at a fraction of the cost, I decided I wanted to buy the genuine. So I went to the local vape shop and bam, they had em in stock. It was a bit more expensive, but I was more than happy to pay the extra, understanding the fact they have to make money too. I expressed my concerns about clones and was reassured they were all genuine products sold there minus a few RBAs.
Once home, naturally I tore into the box like a little damn kid on Xmas. First, noticing the threads were a bit messed up, then noticing the heads had no markings on them, but everything else was marked as supposed to be. So I filled it up with some topp dog, let it sit for a good fifteen and then was hoping to experience a great vape. I burnt the first nasty ass tasting coil up in less than two hours. The next coil couldn't decide if it was 5 ohms, 3 ohms or 2.5 ohms. Completely useless.
The next day went back to the store and expressed my concerns. At first it was said your vaping on too high of a setting, your burning your wicks. In which it was explained that it's kinda hard to burn the wicks at 7 watts, but if that's the case I want a refund because this is a shit product. So then another employee said that it was probably two bad coils. Sometimes a bad batch comes through the lines. They gave me two updated kanger heads that have more of a internal wick, and said that should solve the issue. And that the threads being messed up just need a good cleaning.
The new heads did indeed work better, I got a whole day out of one. I was quite impressed, notice the sarcasm. So I did what I should have done in the beginning and I scratched that little Gray code off the side of the box and entered it into the kanger authenticity checker deal. The message I received was .. Beware of imitations, this number has been looked up 3775 times since 12/15/2013.
So now I'm quite upset, but i started thinking... Damn it looks just like the real deal... I wonder if the vape shop knew this or if they got screwed over too and thought they had purchased genuine items. Back to the store I went. Taking the tank and box inside I explained it all again and pulled the number up on my phone and showed them the message I had received. First thing that was said is " why did you try to verify its authenticity ". Which I thought odd, but I voiced my concern about them being possibly screwed over and not knowing it. Of course then I was told no owner was there and they'd have to be notified about the situation before anything can be done. And I was asked to come back another day or call in a day or two.
A day later after several phone calls and being passed around and asked again several times of why I would ever check the authenticity of a product, I finally got my answer.

We sell all 1:1 clones at this store except for one brand name that we are authorized to sell. But they are ok to sell as genuine because they are usually made by the same factory, they are just not authorized. You are the first person to ever check the authenticity of a product since we've opened. Bring your tank in and we will look at it to see if we can help with the threads, other than that have a good day. ....Click...

Um...What the fuck... I surely hope not all vape stores practice this. I do not mind buying clones, I do not mind paying extra for items at a local shop. I do however mind buying a item that is said to be genuine(at genuine prices) for it to come out being a clone (that I could have bought for a few bucks online) and the shop knowing this but refusing to admit it unless they are caught. I do not like being tricked and lied too as I know most people don't like it.
So lessons I have learned... If you want a genuine or even if you don't care, but you bought one at local shop and they are 100% reassuring you that it's genuine? Open it up at the counter in front of them and scratch that gray security code. Grab your phone and go to the site and enter it. Then you'll know for sure before the product even leaves the salespersons eyes.

I know this has been a long winded deal, and I'm sure I could add a lot more to this, but I won't torment you all any longer. I truly hope that this is not a common practice. Hopefully my misfortune and my mistake of not verifying things like I should have might help someone else from making this same mistake of wasted money and time on a shit product being sold as genuine.


(H and H vapor , Newport, TN)


Thanks for reading,
Stone
 
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InMyImage

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That sucks. I'd report them to my state attorney general, local better business bureau, write a review on yelp.com and couple of the "find my vape shop" sites out there.

I'd also report them to kangertechusa who will most likely follow up on the issue.

Selling products with fake certs of authenticity is a serious problem.

Bill
 

Stone

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Where might this shop be?
I'm located in east tn. The problem is with me out right naming the shop, I am having a bit of a moral dilemma. There are a few employees who work there that I believe are decent people, and are from what I take are not really long time vapers. I think they are being led astray being told by the owners/ managers everything is legit. And if that is the case. In the area I live, jobs and places to work are few and far .. It has me really twisted on my next course of action.
 
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Stone

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That sucks. I'd report them to my state attorney general, local better business bureau, write a review on yelp.com and couple of the "find my vape shop" sites out there.

I'd also report them to kangertechusa who will most likely follow up on the issue.

Selling products with fake certs of authenticity is a serious problem.

Bill
It truly fooled me. Not that that is a hard thing to do, but the packaging had everything right down to the little card that comes inside of the sealed box saying : product authenticity, to ensure product is ... Yadda, yadda.. Scratch off gray strip..Go to www.szkanger.com..
 

InMyImage

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It truly fooled me. Not that that is a hard thing to do, but the packaging had everything right down to the little card that comes inside of the sealed box saying : product authenticity, to ensure product is ... Yadda, yadda.. Scratch off gray strip..Go to www.szkanger.com..

I had the same card in my EVOD 2 kit I recently bought but didn't see a scratch off so I went looking and found it and fortunately my code was good, so I'm glad that my shop is as good as all the great help that they gave me while I was trying to figure all this stuff out last month after deciding that cigalikes were not quite what I was hoping for.
 

Stone

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The flip side: everyone who shops there also livesbin an area with few jobs, where money is probably tight. They are all being cheated. Sell a clone as a clone at clone prices. Dont lie cheat and steal peoples hard earned money.

And that's exactly the case in this area. There are a lot of good people here, and trusting people. I believe that's the only reason why this has been going on. Considering I'm the first to try and authenticate a item. I'm no where close to being done with what needs to be done, but at the same time I do want to think it thru and make the right choices with the proper approach.[/QUOTE]
 
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BigNasty

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Nope I say out the dirty fuckers knowingly committing fraud, it is a dangerous unknown product of manufacture from an unknown counterfeit factory..
They are putting your local vapers at risk, don;t give a shit and are out for lining their own pockets.

FUCK EM!!
 

Stone

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I had the same card in my EVOD 2 kit I recently bought but didn't see a scratch off so I went looking and found it and fortunately my code was good, so I'm glad that my shop is as good as all the great help that they gave me while I was trying to figure all this stuff out last month after deciding that cigalikes were not quite what I was hoping for.
I'm glad your shop is a good shop. Gives me a bit more hope. There is only one other shop within about a hours drive of where I live. Hopefully I'll be able to venture there within the next few days. Fingers crossed it is not the same owners.
 

CaFF

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Ah, thanks for this.
I'd spaced checking the scratch number on my MVPv2 I'd gotten from Ebay, but just checked it right now and it's legit. :)
 

Stone

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Nope I say out the dirty fuckers knowingly committing fraud, it is a dangerous unknown product of manufacture from an unknown counterfeit factory..
They are putting your local vapers at risk, don;t give a shit and are out for lining their own pockets.

FUCK EM!!
That's how I've felt most of the day since the comment of ....its a 1:1 so it's ok to sell as genuine... But I'm trying to attempt and think it thru with the best way to go about it. Not saying that I don't want to go up there and so some shit kicking, but that would get me no where and I would probably lose any chance of really bringing this into the open. Not sure if this is the right choice but ...
 

BigNasty

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That's how I've felt most of the day since the comment of ....its a 1:1 so it's ok to sell as genuine... But I'm trying to attempt and think it thru with the best way to go about it. Not saying that I don't want to go up there and so some shit kicking, but that would get me no where and I would probably lose any chance of really bringing this into the open. Not sure if the right choice but ...
Here is your forum please post the shop name, do it as a warning for others.
 

CaFF

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Here is your forum please post the shop name, do it as a warning for others.

The main problem I see is the old axiom of "don't shit where you live".
If they find out, being in a small town in that area, he could have some IRL problems unrelated to a vaping forum. We don't want that either.
 

Stone

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Here is your forum please post the shop name, do it as a warning for others.
I reckon that you are right, and I'm sure that was the main question and reasonings as Tom had with his post. I'll edit the original post with the company name in it so someone wouldn't need to search thru all of the posts.
 

Stone

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The main problem I see is the old axiom of "don't shit where you live".
If they find out, being in a small town in that area, he could have some IRL problems unrelated to a vaping forum. We don't want that either.
I have thought about that as well, but if that's the case so be it. It's no skin off my back. Just money lost from my wallet and no telling how many others.
 

InMyImage

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Just to help you get your own money back
http://www.capitol.tn.gov/Bills/101/Bill/HB2862.pdf
TN law: http://www.capitol.tn.gov/Bills/101/Bill/HB2862.pdf
Federal Law: http://www.justice.gov/usao/eousa/foia_reading_room/usam/title9/crm01857.htm

"KangerTech" is a legally registered Trademark and thus is afforded the legal protections as such is protected at both the state and federal level. http://tmsearch.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4807:kixl6j.2.2

I agree that sometimes it is a tough decision to do something that could have an adverse impact on a company that provides a value or service to the local populace, especially if they carry other products like juice that you like. But you need to now ask yourself whether you take their word that the juice they are selling is not counterfeit.

At a minimum I'd print off the documents referenced, take them to the store and politely provide them to the store owner or manager and ask for your money back without causing any sort of scene and at least not be personally out of pocket.

Good luck,

Bill
 

BUDKISS

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Reading this thread made me worry and wonder. And so I dug out my kanger mega tank box and found that little itsy bitsy scratch off and found an even smaller number. (Damn, are my eyes that bad?!). A sigh of relief after checking the code online.

I am in favor of holding business to a level of honesty and integrity. Maybe there is some way to do this without it coming back to bite you personally. I wonder if Joe would be willing to get involved?
 

Stone

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Just to help you get your own money back
TN law: http://www.capitol.tn.gov/Bills/101/Bill/HB2862.pdf
Federal Law: http://www.justice.gov/usao/eousa/foia_reading_room/usam/title9/crm01857.htm

"KangerTech" is a legally registered Trademark and thus is afforded the legal protections as such is protected at both the state and federal level. http://tmsearch.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4807:kixl6j.2.2

I agree that sometimes it is a tough decision to do something that could have an adverse impact on a company that provides a value or service to the local populace, especially if they carry other products like juice that you like. But you need to now ask yourself whether you take their word that the juice they are selling is not counterfeit.

At a minimum I'd print off the documents referenced, take them to the store and politely provide them to the store owner or manager and ask for your money back without causing any sort of scene and at least not be personally out of pocket.

Good luck,

Bill
Thank you very much for taking the time to sort these links out for me. I am pretty sure that the money have spent will not be refunded. Which I can deal with more than the simple fact of being deceived like this. I've compiled a list of all the vendors they use and plan on making calls to verify if they are even a dealer.
I know they are a authorized dealer for innokin and they do sell their genuine products. But as you stated about the juice, it also raises a concern.
 

Stone

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Reading this thread made me worry and wonder. And so I dug out my kanger mega tank box and found that little itsy bitsy scratch off and found an even smaller number. (Damn, are my eyes that bad?!). A sigh of relief after checking the code online.

I am in favor of holding business to a level of honesty and integrity. Maybe there is some way to do this without it coming back to bite you personally. I wonder if Joe would be willing to get involved?
Yes I hate to admit it but I too needed a magnifying glass.. Damn numbers are way too small. Unfortunately there is always going to be a push and pull effect no matter how a situation is dealt with. It's just a matter of attempting to keep it as balanced as one can.
 

CaFF

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Thank you very much for taking the time to sort these links out for me. I am pretty sure that the money have spent will not be refunded. Which I can deal with more than the simple fact of being deceived like this. I've compiled a list of all the vendors they use and plan on making calls to verify if they are even a dealer.
I know they are a authorized dealer for innokin and they do sell their genuine products. But as you stated about the juice, it also raises a concern.

As I just did, you can check your Innokin products from them at: http://innokin.com/index.php/verify-device

Just because they had been a dealer, doesn't mean they couldn't have been revoked. Or, that they bought from a dealer that was verified.
A lot of drop-shipping from FT going on these days. ;-)

Lotta B&M shops just outright lie as most people won't bother to even check.
 
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Stone

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As I just did, you can check your Innokin products from them at: http://innokin.com/index.php/verify-device

Just because they had been a dealer, doesn't mean they could have been revoked. Or, that they bought from a dealer that was verified.
A lot of drop-shipping from FT going on these days. ;-)

Lotta B&M shops just outright lie as most people won't bother to even check.

It really is a shame, but I shouldn't be surprised.
I've been steaming about this all day. To the point of just about using all my juice up except 10 ml :mad:. Which indeed has screwed me in another sense..
I know for a fact from now on I'll be checking every security tag from a B&M or online the very moment I get the product in my hands.
 

BigNasty

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It really is a shame, but I shouldn't be surprised.
I've been steaming about this all day. To the point of just about using all my juice up except 10 ml :mad:. Which indeed has screwed me in another sense..
I know for a fact from now on I'll be checking every security tag from a B&M or online the very moment I get the product in my hands.
that is a good call.

I just got informed a new shop opened up and they rewicked my mothers protank... what they did was throw a silca wick on top of the already cotton wicked parallel coil... just from a few hours in that thick juice and wicked hot coil was scorched.
I need to knock a few heads for pulling that bullshit.
 

Stone

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That's just ridiculous. There really is no level that people will not stoop to. And with that they don't seem to give a rats ass who they screw over or even for that matter how it affects that person.
 

BigNasty

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That's just ridiculous. There really is no level that people will not stoop to. And with that they don't seem to give a rats ass who they screw over or even for that matter how it affects that person.
Exactly I really want to know if they are that fucking stupid or willingly fucking with someone's build while clueless.
 

InMyImage

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The really sad thing is that a big reason why people support their local small businesses and mom and pop shops is for the service and expectation that they are getting good advice and good products (within reason).

Stories like this are a big reason that a lot of people turn to the internet for these sorts of specialized products since if they can't trust the local B&M, why shouldn't they trust some "company" operating a storefront (frequently just a Wordpress skin) on the internet which is more convenient unless you have an immediate need that supersedes your desire to NOT pay exorbitant next day delivery charges.

I can respect a decision to not confront the store directly though. I have issues with anger and confrontation (mainly managing the anger) and have learned that it is better for me to just walk away sometimes and never do business with the people again.
 

Stone

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Exactly I really want to know if they are that fucking stupid or willingly fucking with someone's build while clueless.
Before this happened with the clone deal. I always figured the worst part of a vape shop would be a inexperienced employee selling cheap batteries and a mod to someone just starting off. Then telling them how "cool" it is to cloud chase and sub ohm. Giving the impression to the new to be vapor that hey you wrap this little wire thing around that white fluffy thing and no worries. Just puff away , don't mind the smell of burning wires or the heat in your hand. I know that is exaggerated slim chance, but the fact they are intentionally manipulating a product or deceiving never really crossed my mind.
 

BigNasty

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Before this happened with the clone deal. I always figured the worst part of a vape shop would be a inexperienced employee selling cheap batteries and a mod to someone just starting off. Then telling them how "cool" it is to cloud chase and sub ohm. Giving the impression to the new to be vapor that hey you wrap this little wire thing around that white fluffy thing and no worries. Just puff away , don't mind the smell of burning wires or the heat in your hand. I know that is exaggerated slim chance, but the fact they are intentionally manipulating a product or deceiving never really crossed my mind.

No the one up here did it and burnt out my coil build. it is a pretty straight forward pain in the nuts build with 34 ga wire.. but putting on un treated silica that BURNED has me almost murderously angry.
Have seen some fly by night assholes around here just handing people unknown batteries with a .18 dual parallel build in a k100 with a bad clone trident or patriot.
 

Stone

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The really sad thing is that a big reason why people support their local small businesses and mom and pop shops is for the service and expectation that they are getting good advice and good products (within reason).

Stories like this are a big reason that a lot of people turn to the internet for these sorts of specialized products since if they can't trust the local B&M, why shouldn't they trust some "company" operating a storefront (frequently just a Wordpress skin) on the internet which is more convenient unless you have an immediate need that supersedes your desire to NOT pay exorbitant next day delivery charges.

I can respect a decision to not confront the store directly though. I have issues with anger and confrontation (mainly managing the anger) and have learned that it is better for me to just walk away sometimes and never do business with the people again.
And I truly would have supported them and promoted the shop. I was really hoping that it was a fluke or that they had been scammed, which I'm sure could happen. But after spending as much money as I have there and then this. It's just a slap in the face.
Unfortunately if the other b&m is owned by the same company or if they are affiliated I pretty much have no choice but the internet. Which I have concerns as well.
I am level headed for the most part but I do not believe I would be able to keep my cool. So more than likely I will not be returning, and just eat the cash spent. Keeps things simpler and less dramatic.
 

Stone

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No the one up here did it and burnt out my coil build. it is a pretty straight forward pain in the nuts build with 34 ga wire.. but putting on un treated silica that BURNED has me almost murderously angry.
Have seen some fly by night assholes around here just handing people unknown batteries with a .18 dual parallel build in a k100 with a bad clone trident or patriot.
I don't blame you one bit. They don't have a care with what they are doing.

That's what gives vaping a bad name and makes headlines. They love that shit. Anything negative towards vaping at all. They aren't targeting the people making this hazardous and dangerous. They are attacking it in general. Not to mention the people who could possibly or have gotten hurt, or lost products due to (them)fucking with something. My mind is just spinning with all of this shit. It's insanity the things some are doing.
 

BigNasty

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I don't blame you one bit. They don't have a care with what they are doing.

That's what gives vaping a bad name and makes headlines. They love that shit. Anything negative towards vaping at all. They aren't targeting the people making this hazardous and dangerous. They are attacking it in general. Not to mention the people who could possibly or have gotten hurt, or lost products due to (them)fucking with something. My mind is just spinning with all of this shit. It's insanity the things some are doing.
I am rage filled since mom is a cancer survivor and I got her to quit via vaping and restrict the diacetyl and no silica in her set up.
 

Stone

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I am rage filled since mom is a cancer survivor and I got her to quit via vaping and restrict the diacetyl and no silica in her set up.
And I'm sure that you had told this to them probably more than once which in turn makes the situation far more irritating and pisses you off even more. Did you even get a apology or just a stale stare and a shrug of the shoulder?
 

BigNasty

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And I'm sure that you had told this to them probably more than once which in turn makes the situation far more irritating and pisses you off even more. Did you even get a apology or just a stale stare and a shrug of the shoulder?
I found out at 740ish tonight my time.
I will be following up with them tomorrow in person, to inquire
A. if they are stupid and clueless
B. or just in it for fleecing vapers.

Depending on the outcome I will be outting them also.
Keep strong stone and take those fools to total task.
 
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Stone

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And I'm sure that you had told this to them probably more than once which in turn makes the situation far more irritating and pisses you off even more. Did you even get a apology or just a stale stare and a shrug of the shoulder?
Sitting here rereading this is getting to me even more. I see that this issue I had is small compared to some of the issues that are going on as a whole. And it's not the vaping community, the community that vaping has become seems like a tight group of people, friends and I'm sure even family like in some cases. Its the parasites that that see dollar signs on every potential person that is wanting to (usually) kick the cigs and start a healthier lifestyle. And it would seem to be they are inserting themselves in every crevice they can find with hopes of not being called out. Not caring what damage they cause just to make their $.
 

Stone

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I found out at 740ish tonight my time.
I will be following up with them tomorrow in person, to inquire
A. if they are stupid and clueless
B. or just in it for fleecing vapers.

Depending on the outcome I will be outting them also.
Keep strong stone and take those fools to total task.
I got my fingers crossed for you in hopes of getting it sorted out. Your mom doesn't need that kind of bull now that she is vaping and already been thru so much.
 

TheDude

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You said you have a moral dilemma, and don't want to name the vape shop in question...I'm not sure i understand, isn't it your moral responsibility to make sure no one else gets ripped off by these unscrupulous thieves?
 

Breeezy

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Shops like this give other vape shops a bad name. You should post this into their yelp page if they have one and put it into reviews for this shop. I can't believe they asked why you checked it, and also they can't sell anything unauthentic and say it is because it's made in the same factory.
 

Stone

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You said you have a moral dilemma, and don't want to name the vape shop in question...I'm not sure i understand, isn't it your moral responsibility to make sure no one else gets ripped off by these unscrupulous thieves?
Indeed it was a dilemma at first. But after talking with a few VU members and them expressing the same concern as you (as in the posts above ) i placed the name of the vapor shop and city in the original post shortly after posting. It's at the bottom of the original post. I figured with me placing it there instead of mixed in with the posts it would have been easier to notice. Maybe I was wrong?
 

Stone

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Shops like this give other vape shops a bad name. You should post this into their yelp page if they have one and put it into reviews for this shop. I can't believe they asked why you checked it, and also they can't sell anything unauthentic and say it is because it's made in the same factory.
I was defiantly confused a bit when the asked why I checked, but now seeing the answer I received about their sales practice I understand. And yes I do plan on doing the yelp deal and a few other reviews about this. It is very bothersome for a company to deceive its customers and then manipulate the wording of a 1:1 clone being "the same" ,"made in the same factory" bullcrap just to attempt to convince the consumer that they haven't been ripped off.
 

Stone

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There is a B&M around where I live that sells only clones. A few of the guys try to sell them as authentic but I can't tell if it's out of ignorance or greed
I believe most companies do sell clones. And I understand why and I usually have no issue with that. It's where they cross the line selling them as true deals that is the issue. I don't think ignorance would be factor with the shop selling them as such, except in the case of a employee possibly being duped as well or not knowing enough about vaping themselves. These store owners know exactly what they are doing. It is deeply disturbing.
 

BigNasty

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I believe most companies do sell clones. And I understand why and I usually have no issue with that. It's where they cross the line selling them as true deals that is the issue. I don't think ignorance would be factor with the shop selling them as such, except in the case of a employee possibly being duped as well or not knowing enough about vaping themselves. These store owners know exactly what they are doing. It is deeply disturbing.
That is why I say out them.. no restraint.
Selling clones with full disclosure is one thing, selling unknown make counterfeits is another matter altogether.
Not going into the counterfeit vs clone debate on wording but selling a counterfeit of any product as authentic is fraud and theft and talking about vape gear can be damned dangerous.
 

Stone

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That is why I say out them.. no restraint.
Selling clones with full disclosure is one thing, selling unknown make counterfeits is another matter altogether.
Not going into the counterfeit vs clone debate on wording but selling a counterfeit of any product as authentic is fraud and theft and talking about vape gear can be damned dangerous.
Indeed Nasy, and I'm glad that I did listen to you and place their name on here finally. I should have done it in the beginning, but guess I needed that little extra shove in the right direction. Thanks to you and a couple others.

Any luck at you B&M with your situation?
 

BigNasty

Diamond Contributor
Member For 4 Years
ECF Refugee
Indeed Nasy, and I'm glad that I did listen to you and place their name on here finally. I should have done it in the beginning, but guess I needed that little extra shove in the right direction. Thanks to you and a couple others.

Any luck at you B&M with your situation?

Having since posted that the owner got in touch with me and I redacted it.
The dude that fucked my mother's coil is not a rep or employee of their company but hands out the cards. Shit is being dealt with.

So he is supposed to be a member of amsea and he is dealing with the issue at hand.

Good luck on yours Stone.
 
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Pancho_Brown

Silver Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Member For 3 Years
I use to own a B&M not to long ago and I always made sure to label my products as either clones or authebtics. The only clones I had were mech mods and atties. I always made sure people knew they knew what they were getting. The only exception to that was when I got a few fake Sony batteries, but I made sure I didn't sale them and got my money back from the wholesaler
 

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