Judge orders FDA to speed up review of e-cigarettes

Discussion in 'Vaping Related But Doesn't Fit In a Category' started by The Cromwell, May 15, 2019.

  1. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    https://wtop.com/national/2019/05/judge-orders-fda-to-begin-regulating-e-cigarettes/

    WASHINGTON (AP) — A federal judge is siding with public health groups suing the Food and Drug Administration to begin reviewing thousands of e-cigarettes on the U.S. market.

    The ruling handed down Wednesday in district court states that the agency shirked its legal duty when it postponed reviewing all U.S. vaping products by several years.
     
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  2. jwill

    jwill The Great King of Nothing VU Vendor VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 1 Year VU Challenge Team Reddit Exile

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    These anti vape advocates are as bad as the gun grabbers. Always wanting to control everyone else's lives. Despicable, loathsome scum. IMO anyways.
     
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  3. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Every group no matter the political grouping want to control those they disagree with.
    Been that way with humans since Eve convinced Adam to eat the apple ;)

    Fact is we have been on borrowed time ever since the original Deeming regs deadline passed.
    And NO political party has come to the aid of vapers yet...
    All sides are afraid of alienating voters against them for supporting such a small group of people.

    Yeah sucks big time.
     
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  4. jinx'd

    jinx'd Gold Contributor

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    they are doing it for the money, that's their "gig'
     
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  5. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    We do have the best government that money can buy.
     
  6. jinx'd

    jinx'd Gold Contributor

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    public health groups = not government. they just use the government to harass those they don't like.
     
  7. Theboss

    Theboss Silver Contributor ECF Refugee

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    We have a lot of room for American vapers up here in Canada folks ;)
     
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  8. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Same as any other group.
    corporations, Religions, Gay Groups, gun groups, Pink rabbit lovers, etc all do the same.
     
  9. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years VU Challenge Team ECF Refugee

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    I like that the judge's name is Grimm
     
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  10. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Last name was not Green was it?
    I missed the name part.
     
  11. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years VU Challenge Team ECF Refugee

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    But seriously, hope the FDA appeals or better yet, foils the ANTZ groups by approving the applications
     
  12. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    We can hope for the best, but I have prepared for the worst.
    And remember we are talking about government here...
     
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  13. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years VU Challenge Team ECF Refugee

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    Me too, it's the newbs who will lose big time if things don't change for the better
     
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  14. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Yep all those smokers that will not have the same vaping options for quitting that I had.
    Non smokers starting vaping I really do not care about.
    But the smokers....
     
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  15. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years VU Challenge Team ECF Refugee

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    That is the thing for sure
     
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  16. obijuan77

    obijuan77 Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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  17. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    No surprise, This has been looming since before 8-8-2016.
    the vape industry has had years to prepare for this if they wanted.
    Instead they have kept illegally selling vape products not on the US market prior to 8-8-2016. For which there was no extension.
    They knew they could not meet the costs and such associated with the PMTA process so they were just making as much money as they could while they could.
    Few vape shops even try and educate the public about the Deeming regs and try to get more vocal public support for vaping.

    Yep it is pretty much the doom of the US vape market.
    And very sucky and the vape industry has done little to help the situation.
    I WAS a contributing member of CASA and they quit sending me any emails or information. So I quit sending money.

    All this is why I became a Vape Prepper back in 2015.

    I just wonder which aspects the FDA will enforce first?
    Shutting down vendors of the vape stuff in violation of the 8-8-2016 date or wait a while on that allow them to file a PMTA first?
     
  18. Bigrick

    Bigrick Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year ECF Refugee

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    Yes I believe I can handle a vapoclypse. I can build a mech mod, make vapable juice, even make an atomizer. But I SHOULD NOT HAVE TO!!! Because I can does not mean I should have to. I honestly did not read the article. Lacking phone gigs and buffering is a bitch.
     
  19. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Big Rick this is the original text from MY OP. The only difference is that the FDA is NOT goung to challenge the judges ruling.
    Also this link to understand better what it means:
    https://www.fda.gov/tobacco-product...her-electronic-nicotine-delivery-systems-ends

    WASHINGTON (AP) — A federal judge is siding with public health groups suing the Food and Drug Administration to begin reviewing thousands of e-cigarettes on the U.S. market.

    The ruling handed down Wednesday in district court states that the agency shirked its legal duty when it postponed reviewing all U.S. vaping products by several years.

    The American Academy of Pediatrics, Campaign for Tobacco-Free Kids and other groups filed the federal lawsuit in Maryland last year. The groups say the lack of FDA oversight has led to an explosion in underage vaping by teenagers, threatening to hook a generation of Americans on nicotine.


    “It is now the FDA’s responsibility to take immediate action to protect our kids and require manufacturers to apply to the FDA if they want to keep their products on the market,” the groups said in a statement.

    E-cigarettes are nicotine-emitting devices that have grown into a multibillion-dollar industry in the U.S. despite little research on their long-term health effects, including whether they are useful in helping smokers quit cigarettes.

    The FDA gained authority to regulate the products in 2016, but it has allowed thousands of products to remain on the market without formal rules or product standards. The agency says that both FDA staff and manufacturers need more time to prepare for regulation.

    The public health groups have warned that the lack of oversight could undo decades of anti-tobacco efforts as young people migrate toward newer vaping products.

    U.S. Judge Paul Grimm agreed, calling the FDA’s delay “so extreme as to amount to an abdication of its statutory responsibilities.”

    FDA spokesman Michael Felberbaum said in an emailed statement that the agency is reviewing the court decision and “will continue to tackle the troubling epidemic of e-cigarette use among kids.” The agency will have the option of appealing the decision.

    Gregory Conley of the American Vaping Association said the government “must appeal this ruling” to “protect adult access to less harmful alternatives to cigarettes.”

    Under President Donald Trump’s FDA commissioner, Scott Gottlieb — who departed last month — the FDA said it would not require e-cigarette manufacturers to submit their products for review until 2022. Shortly before stepping down Gottlieb moved the deadline up to 2021.

    But Grimm’s ruling suggests the FDA must move much faster. He calls for the health groups and the FDA to submit plans for moving forward with product reviews within 30 days.

    Wednesday’s ruling follows a similar decision last September, when a federal judge said the FDA must move ahead with adding graphic warning labels to cigarette packs. The FDA was required to take that step under a 2009 law, but the process has been bogged down by legal challenges from tobacco companies.

    “The courts are clearly pushing FDA — at behest of medical and consumer groups — to step up their regulatory pressure on industry,” said Marc Scheineson, a former FDA official who now advises companies with the law firm Alston & Bird.

    Scheineson said he expects the FDA to argue that it doesn’t have the resources to process the flood of applications that industry would submit if the ruling is enforced.

    The FDA and most health experts agree that e-cigarettes are likely less harmful than traditional cigarettes because they don’t produce the cancer-causing byproducts of burning tobacco. But there is little research on their long-term health effects, particularly for young people.

    Nicotine is what makes both cigarettes and e-cigarettes addictive, and health experts say the chemical is harmful to developing brains.

    Separately on Wednesday, North Carolina’s attorney general announced the first state lawsuit against e-cigarette giant Juul, which dominates the U.S. vaping market.
     
  20. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I just have trouble drumming up much sympathy for the vape industry.

    On another note look for some outstanding sales in the not too distant future.

    My advise is the same as it has been for a few years now.
    Learn DIY
    Only use rebuildables
    And stock up on the mods and attys you like to use.

    We will still be able to get PG/VG
    flavorings.
    Freebase nic may well become a problem in the not too distant future.
    Batteries will still be available and cotton and wire as well.
     
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  21. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Very unfortunately the full implementation of the deeming regs will pretty much kill ad revenues on sites like this.
    I am a contributing member and would be willing to contribute more to keep thins running.
     
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  22. obijuan77

    obijuan77 Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Yep unfortunately it seems as if the vape industry kinda just stuck their collective heads in the sand and hoped this would all just go away, but it didn't, and now it's here.

    I also have been prepping for this scenario for the past 2.5 years.

    -Only use RDA/RTA's
    -DIY all my juice
    -I prefer using my regulated mods, but have a nice stash of a dozen different mechs just for this.
    -With this news, I think I'm going to pick up a few more Aegis Solos' to add to my 30 other regulated mods.
    -I have close to 30 rebuildables with plenty of duplicates of all my favs.

    Only thing left is to buy more nicotine, but I'm going to try to wait until it starts getting colder and will prob buy another 3-4 liters in addition to what I already have.
    Damn freezer space is going to be an issue though...

    Might have to invest in a small freezer just for my nicotine. damn.
     
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  23. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Wife cannot do stairs and the deep freeze is in the basement so the wife does not know how much vape stuff I have in there :)
     
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  24. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years VU Challenge Team ECF Refugee

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    There's always a silver lining, lol

    It is comforting to know I can vape in the style I'm accustomed to no matter what the government does :)
     
  25. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Yep same here.

    Just have sympathy for the vapers that have no clue what is coming.
     
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  26. bikerboogieman

    bikerboogieman Bronze Contributor

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    That settles it, I'm going to start learning how to diy and pick up some rda's to be prepared for a vapoclypse.
     
  27. obijuan77

    obijuan77 Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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  28. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I really do not need any more vape stuff.
    But will be a sale vulture for the panic sales coming if this all pans out like it looks like it will.
     
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  29. obijuan77

    obijuan77 Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Yea, I didn't 'need' them really, but I had them in the back of my mind, just wasn't in too much of a hurry until today.


    Definitely!!!
     
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  30. jinx'd

    jinx'd Gold Contributor

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    if this does happen, there will be a LOT of CHEAP vape stuff on Craigslist.
     
  31. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years VU Challenge Team ECF Refugee

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    China started pumping out a lot of very low quality shit after 8/8 passed

    But, lets say this is the end (maybe it is, maybe it isn't) - China immediately started selling mods with a 510 flashlight attachment instead of atomizer

    The real weak link in prepping for vapocolypse is atomizers

    You can make a mod out of almost anything, atomizers require some serious skill and specialty tools most of us dorks (except Cromwell, lol) don't have

    This is why you will often see me post handchecks with expensive atties and cheap shit mods
     
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  32. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Don't think so, there's going to be a lot of people looking for gear and a few stockpiler's like myself "may" sell if the price is right.
     
  33. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Another major problem for the NON DIY types will be ejuice.
    Only ejuice on the market before Feb 2007 is exempt from PMTA approval requirement.
     
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  34. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    yep, 8/8 came around is when I got into Mech's and also got into rebuilding. I haven't looked back and I have to say I've got more than enough shit to open a vape shop. I've only got a couple regulated mod's and only a couple sub ohm tanks, everything else is Mech's, RDA's and RTA's ( shit load)
     
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  35. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Yep only cheap stuff will be retailers trying to dump their stock before the hammer falls. Assuming that it falls.
     
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  36. AndriaD

    AndriaD O-Mi-Gawd it's HOT! VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 4 Years ECF Refugee

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    Likewise. I would definitely be willing to donate more, if VU's ad revenues go the way of the dodo. I recommend this place to anyone who happens to read any of my "answers" on Quora, and it's linked in the footer of my own blog.

    Andria
     
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  37. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I've got 4 1/2 liters of 100mg Nic PG sitting in the freezer ;)
     
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  38. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I have 4 liters of 100 mg/ml nic in glass in the freezer.
    I only vape around 1.5 mg now so I have many years worth.

    May get another liter, may not....
     
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  39. r055co

    r055co VU Donator Platinum Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    IMO the Trading Post here needs to go strictly members only and with that only vetted members have access. One needs to just take the example to website selling tobacco were shut down.
     
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  40. obijuan77

    obijuan77 Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    was there even juice back then?!o_O
     
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  41. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    One concern that I have is Bull City Flavors.
    They changed their name from Bull city Vapors to Bull City flavors.
    Great move.
    Then they started the ejuice recipe thing which kind killed the legal move of the name change...
    100% PG Chinese stuff I think is about all.
     
  42. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Some legal ass covering will be needed imnsho
     
  43. obijuan77

    obijuan77 Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    interesting point. wonder if just 'removing' that would be enough to escape intact


    :eek:
     
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  44. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Probably, esp if they do it before they get jumped on.

    My understanding of the regs is based a lot on intent esp where flavorings and such are concerned.

    And brands like Capella have never promoted (openly at least) their flavorings for vaping.
    Some brands with vape on the label or in the name though will get shut down.
     
  45. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years VU Challenge Team ECF Refugee

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    It will just be recipes for aroma therapy and VG or PG based lotion, lol
     
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  46. obijuan77

    obijuan77 Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    hmmm. should we tag will?
     
  47. obijuan77

    obijuan77 Silver Contributor Member For 1 Year

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    Well if they put a big disclaimer in bold on the site that says:

    "not intended for use with e cigarettes"

    LMAO
     
  48. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy My name is Lucy and I am a squonkaholic Staff Member Senior Moderator VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years VU Challenge Team ECF Refugee

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    Yeah, like the Kratom selling sites say : Not for human consumption :facepalm:
     
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  49. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    That would likely work.
    Or tobacco flavored beverages?
    A good burley capiccino?
     
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  50. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Hmm have to wonder about the tobacco flavorings....
    Might need to order some more Hangsen Desert Ship?
     

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