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High-power rigs are killing my vaping enjoyment

Discussion in 'Vaping Related But Doesn't Fit In a Category' started by Giraut, Oct 21, 2017.

  1. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    I have not had vapers tongue since I quit commercial ejuice over 2.5 years ago.
    I DIY with a max flavoring of 10% and usually around 7.5%.
     
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  2. okeasykilla

    okeasykilla Member For 4 Years

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    Just a visual aid here. I doubt I’ll convert you from the Achilles you love. I’m starting to feel the same way about the siren 2 & I’ve only had it a few days.
    IMG_1245.JPG



    Sent from the future.
     
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  3. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    Ok... visual aid for what? I can't really tell anything about it... except that it has THREE huge airholes under where the coil goes, which disqualifies it immediately as too airy. If they had ONE hole, about half to two-thirds that size, it might be worth trying.

    Andria
     
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  4. okeasykilla

    okeasykilla Member For 4 Years

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    The coil fasteners. The flathead screws. As far as airflow, you can close off the airflow to half (or more) of the smallest hole. It’s a tighter draw than a cigarette.


    Sent from the future.
     
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  5. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    Even with tight external airflow, if the internal airholes are too large, it's impossible to get good "suction"; it just feels mooshy and airy. I've found this with EVERY SINGLE supposedly-adjustable atty I've ever tried, if the internal airhole(s) are too large, there's just too much air and not enough suck. And I HATE flathead screws -- you have to re-seat the screwdriver after every turn. With Phillips head screws, the screwdriver stays where it ought to -- like Kayfuns, original Lemos, Achilles, and Berserker. When I got my Strike18 squonk atty, I had to hunt thru every bag of parts I own, to find 2 phillips that were small enough to fit that atty, so I didn't have to make up a whole new cussing vocabulary everytime I wanted to do something with that coil.

    Andria
     
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  6. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    Yep Andria without the hole under the coil being tight enough you cannot get a really good tight MTL vape.
    I can shut down the air on a subtank mini to a tight draw but it is not a good tight MTL atty.
     
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  7. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    Yep; that's exactly my experience. Now this Berserker... EXCELLENT tight draw.... but the flavor...hmm... nothing to write home about. I guess I could go back to making 30% flavoring ejuice, if I want to keep using the Berserker, but that seems counterproductive. But I just coiled it yesterday, so I'll keep at it for a few more days and see if it breaks in and gives me good flavor, if I keep turning up the wattage. Next thing to try is probably the 6-wrap 7/64 with 30ga; after which, I may try using the taller chimney and tank and see if that helps any.

    Andria
     
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  8. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    I meant to add also, about the Siren 2.. apparently 2mm is the smallest external airhole on that... and that's at least 1mm too large. The Berserker has a 1mm hole, and also a .8mm hole; I can tolerate both, though I prefer the .8mm. Anything larger would be too airy. I sometimes do use the 1mm hole on the Berserker when first breaking it in, to make sure and not burn the cotton, but at this point, I'm using the .8mm. And it's really not a bad vape at all; if I'd never experienced the Achilles, I'd probably be dancing on the ceiling. But the Achilles has spoiled me, it's just so fucking GREAT.

    Andria
     
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  9. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    The velocity of the air that hits the coil is important. If your coil airjet is larger than your AFC air inlet hole you will not have an optimum vape whether mtl or dtl vaping.
    That assumes a well designed atty of course.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2017
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  10. dropin_biking

    dropin_biking Member For 2 Years Member For 1 Year

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    I'm assuming a good design for tight airflow and flavour would be placing the restriction JUST under the coil? Anything before that doesn't really matter, and everything after that just needs to focus on keeping the pathway narrow (IE narrow drip top, tapered chamber)?
     
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  11. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    yep pretty much. Small chamber and pretty small driptip bore.

    Not really possible to make a good True MTL and DTL all in one vape.

    also side airflow does not usually work for a good MTL vape either.
     
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  12. dropin_biking

    dropin_biking Member For 2 Years Member For 1 Year

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    Good to know. I've got my TFV8 RBA I'm using now. It will never give me MTL hits. No matter how much I turn down the airflow, it still feels like a thin airy hit, I suppose because the air flow slots are massive.

    I've got a Geekvape Ammit on the way, I'm convinced that should be significantly better for MTL hits.

    Would something like the Augvape Merlin Mini offer even better MTL hits? Considering it has inter-changable air-flow restrictions directly under the coil?

    [​IMG]

    That's the deck of the Ammit, and here's the deck of the Merlin Mini

    [​IMG]
     
  13. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    For a very loose MTL maybe.

    Merlin mini should do better at MTL than the Ammit. But the chamber is kinda large for a really good MTL atty.

    The origional Merliin was a good restricted lung hit atty.
     
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  14. dropin_biking

    dropin_biking Member For 2 Years Member For 1 Year

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    From what I gathered the Mini is shorter which makes for a smaller chamber? And I know the merlin mini has more restrictive airflow inserts so I don't see how it could perform any worse?

    Either way is it safe to say either of these will offer a tighter hit than my current TFV8 RBA in a Melo 300?
     
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  15. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    yes I think that is safe to say.
    Seems like Vaping V1ck has reviews on both of those. I saw reviews on both and I only watch him, the other Vic, Todd and Vaping Biker.
     
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  16. Ryedan

    Ryedan Silver Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    In that case, my girl is definitely not a lady, more like silent but deadly [​IMG]

    The good thing is that when I blow one, I can just look at her and roll my eyes, and it works [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  17. Ryedan

    Ryedan Silver Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    Hang on ... I thought women didn't fart or belch because they can't keep quiet long enough in the first place :blah:

    Annnnnnd ... I'm outta here before I get [​IMG]
     
  18. Ryedan

    Ryedan Silver Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    For me vaper's tongue was all about chain vaping like I did for a while after switching from smoking. I used to have 2 or 3 setups going with different juices and switch between them often. Haven't had that issue since I stopped doing that. I also don't use much flavoring.
     
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  19. Rossum

    Rossum Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I beg to differ. I'm strictly MTl and all my atties have side airflow.
     
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  20. HondaDavidson

    HondaDavidson Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    Air volume INside the atty and drip tip size has more affect on draw IMO than does the size of the inlet. Big holes under a coil mean big voluminous air passages..

    Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk
     
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  21. Ryedan

    Ryedan Silver Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    Does it leak if it's on its side @okeasykilla?
     
  22. okeasykilla

    okeasykilla Member For 4 Years

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    I can picture that.


    Sent from the future.
     
  23. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    Looser MTL or tight as heck MTL?

    Hardcore MTL vapers go for around a 1 mm max air jet on the coil.

    But I could be wrong have been once or twice.

    What attys with side airflow do you use?
     
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  24. okeasykilla

    okeasykilla Member For 4 Years

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    No, I’ve only had it a couple days now but, so far no. I woke up this morning & found my mod on its side next to me. No leaks, No e juice on the blanket.


    Sent from the future.
     
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  25. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    I'm still not sure the small chamber really matters. The Achilles is 22mm and fairly tall for an RDA (about 35mm), but has flavor that can knock you down. But the internal airhole directly beneath the coil is 1.5mm, and the external airflow can be adjusted still tighter. It has MUCH better flavor than any tank I've ever used, which all have small internal chambers and some even have a domed shape at the top of those small chambers.

    Andria
     
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  26. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    I mostly dislike side airflow as not providing much flavor, but the Strike18 is a surprise; the flavor is pretty decent. But that one does have a small chamber, being only 18mm wide, and rather short also, and can be tightened up really well.

    Andria
     
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  27. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    As I said, I don't think the chamber matters much -- but that huge honkin airhole under the coil would make that a shitty vape.

    Andria
     
  28. HondaDavidson

    HondaDavidson Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    There are exceptions to every rule....... Fact of nature.



    Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk
     
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  29. HondaDavidson

    HondaDavidson Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    I think on the achilles it's the velocity of the air hitting the coil... causes allot of fast expansion and aides atomization. That little inlet blowing a jet of air on the coil the exploding into a cloud. Like a Garden hose in a bucket. Fast in.. expands... slow out..

    Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk
     
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  30. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    Actually I'm not really sure there is a lot of expansion, because the top cap has this cool lil dealie:

    achilles-cap.jpg

    As I've learned, since I like mounting the coil high for best TH, you can't mount it too high or it runs right into that projection on the underside of the cap -- it's like the tiny airhole under the coil blows a fierce blast of air straight up onto and around the coil, and directly upward to your mouth.

    For those not acquainted, this is the tiny airhole in question:

    achillesairhole.jpg

    As you'll also note, the thing is entirely threaded, AND all threads backed up with o-rings; because of the clever design of the airhole stack, this thing simply can't leak, even when you lay it down, unless a) you overfill, or b) an o-ring goes bad -- which does happen sometimes of course, but god knows I've got plenty of 22mm o-rings round here. :D

    The $64,000 quEstion is WHY THE HELL AREN'T THESE SOLD ANYMORE?!?!?!?!?!?! THEY'RE ONLY FUCKING PERFECT!!!!!!!!!

    Andria
     
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  31. dropin_biking

    dropin_biking Member For 2 Years Member For 1 Year

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    Well coming from the world of spray guns, which I'm a little more familiar with. There's two main factors, CFM, and air pressure. Lower CFM at the same air pressure creates less atomization. So applying that, restricting air flow at the AFC cuts off CFM, but if the air hole at the coil is still tighter than the AFC (flows less cfm) you you can still create high pressure, but lack the CFM to fully flush the air away from the coil.

    However, if the air flow to the coil less restricted than at the AFC, you are gaining CFM, and losing air pressure. This would equate to thinner, weaker clouds.

    If I understand correctly, the AFC ring controls CFM, and if your air at the coil is not the same, or less than the CFM flow at the AFC, you will lose air pressure and density to the vape.

    So if I have this correct, the balance is between the area of the coil and what it needs in terms of CFM and air pressure to cool and clear the air, VS the CFM and pressure coming through the air hole to the coil. You can have all the pressure in the world but with not enough CFM the coil will heat and the vape gets hot, too much CFM and not enough pressure results in a thin weak vape?
     
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  32. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    What is "cfm"?

    I've heard different comments about the Achilles; primarily, 99% of folks simply find it too tight, even with the airflow screw completely removed (the original Achilles doesn't have one of those damned AFC rings, thank GOD). Another comment I've heard is that the flavor is so intense, so absolutely saturated, there's the sensation of having ejuice in one's mouth, and I'll admit, when I first started using it, I used to pat my lips to see if there was ejuice -- there wasn't. So I don't think anyone could say this is a "weak" vape -- it's so intense, most who use it -- including me -- had to reduce their usual wattage, and even their nic level, due to the intense TH it provides -- and mounting the coil high makes it even better.

    However because of that intensity and tightness, it requires low wattage -- so there isn't much vapor; as I've noted, it's roughly the same as what I exhaled when I smoked... and why the hell anyone would need more than that, I can't for the life of me fathom whatsoever. It's a tightwad tootle-puffer's dream come true.

    Andria
     
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  33. dropin_biking

    dropin_biking Member For 2 Years Member For 1 Year

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    Cubic feet per minute.
     
  34. Ryedan

    Ryedan Silver Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    Thanks. I just might give one of these style aties a try sometime.
     
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  35. Canadian Vaper

    Canadian Vaper Silver Contributor Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee Reddit Exile

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    I buy and mix, the stuff I buy I have to add about 25% VG to it to tone it down.
     
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  36. Carambrda

    Carambrda Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    I can vape anywhere between 88 watts and 228 watts. I doesn't really matter... what matters instead is the size and design of the RDA, the airflow, and the coil build, so basically the wattage just needs to be tuned specifically towards the combination of all of those things together, including the type of juice as well.

    Here's a single coil build in the 24mm Deathtrap:

    24mm deathtrap.jpg

    ...compare it to this dual coil build in the 30mm Buddha V4:

    trigertons.jpg

    As you can easily figure out, bigger coils = higher wattages. But the amount of vapor is not necessarily always that much bigger... it still always depends.
     
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  37. Rossum

    Rossum Gold Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    Primarily O-16, Nuppin, and sometimes still Cyclone.
    • O-16 with air from both sides using the smallest setting.
    • Nuppin with air from both sides, adjusted to a bit less than a full circle.
    • Cyclone using standard cap. I never cared for the AFC cap much due to the extra height internally (adds chamber volume that decrease vape quality/flavor). I'm all the way up to 1.6mm on the (single) air holes in them, debating going just a little bigger.
    So not super-tight.
     
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  38. OneBadWolf

    OneBadWolf VU Donator Gold Contributor Member For 4 Years ECF Refugee

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    Whatever keeps you off the stinkys. Simples. I'm sick of those who think that people should vape like them. Its divisive if nothing else. I don't care if you make big clouds, or little piffle poofs,as long as you are courteous its all better than smoking.

    What's of minor interest, is that you do not usually hear the cloud crowd whining, and bitching about the piffle poofers destroying vaping for everyone. The insecurity driven compulsion to ensure everyone vapes correctly (like they do) seems to be predominately associated with the low wattage low wattage bunch.

    If you don't think I make big enough clouds, or too big clouds, I assure you, I will give your comments all due consideration. Then, I'll tell you to fuck off. Unless you provide me with my attys, mods, and make my juice for me, you have no credibility, or leverage to affect the way I vape.

    If it is so important to the anal retentive assholes who cannot stand to see anyone doing something differently from themselves, to the extent they need to confabulate intricate and complex manifestos built on bullshit, completely disregarding the laws of supply and demand, in order to portray themselves as some type of victim, that they manage to actually accomplish what the FDA and other conglomerates have failed to do, I'll stand with the cloud crowd.

    At least they blow it out of their mouths.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2017
  39. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    Yeah but you jammed a piece of needle in there to reduce the air hole?
     
  40. VapingInNewYork

    VapingInNewYork Bronze Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    As our friend Anthony said somewhere, there is no wrong way to vape.
     
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  41. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    The reason some of us "whine" about the cloudz bro fad is that the hardware makers have stopped making much of anything else! If there was still plenty of hardware for everyone's taste, it would be a non-issue -- but thx to those who want massive clouds, a) 98% of all hardware is now obnly suitable for them, and b) 99.9% of all commercial ejuice is now suitable only for them. The industry has run off and left conservative vapers and new switchers completely in the dust.

    If I could still buy Achilles RDAs, all the cloudz bro fans could vape themselves into a coma for all I care. But thx to them, I can't.

    Andria
     
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  42. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    No, only in the Achilles II -- the originals are perfect in their virginal state. The Achilles II is one of those abortions that tries to be more than what it is, and thus achieves being absolutely nothing.

    Andria
     
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  43. The Cromwell

    The Cromwell The Frugal Vapist VU Donator Diamond Contributor Member For 4 Years

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    As long as it works for YOU yes.
    But there are many wrong ways to vape.
    Why else all the calls for help?
    Or people blowing their face off?
     
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  44. dropin_biking

    dropin_biking Member For 2 Years Member For 1 Year

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    I'm only bothered by the obnoxious people blowing clouds into peoples faces and in indoor public areas (Yes, I see it all the time) I've yet to meet a genuine vaper who enjoys big clouds for the sake of big clouds. They all tell me they love fogging out areas or surprising people, THAT is obnoxious, and in my opinion, the WRONG way to vape.
     
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  45. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    I like surprising people too. I walk into a vape shop with an RDA on a 75 watt mod and tootle-puff happily. The looks on their faces are priceless; right up there with the "doggie head tilt." :giggle: :giggle: :giggle:

    Andria
     
  46. dropin_biking

    dropin_biking Member For 2 Years Member For 1 Year

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    Is vaping in the vape shop allowed? I'm referring to surprising the random public. For instance as you're walking into walmart...
     
  47. AndriaD

    AndriaD It's NOT freaking BUBONIC PLAGUE! VU Donator Diamond Contributor ECF Refugee Member For 5 Years

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    I generally have my mod put away as we're walking in; I do however take it out and start taking a hit just as I'm exiting the first set of doors, so that when I hit the outdoors, I've already inhaled and can then exhale to mask the stench of cigarette smoke out there.

    Andria
     
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  48. Canadian Vaper

    Canadian Vaper Silver Contributor Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee Reddit Exile

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    I definitely don't blow clouds in peoples faces or intentionally fog up a place, I'll apologize if I do by accident or if the wind picks up and brings it towards someone.

    For me anything over about 0.4ohms won't give me a warm enough vape for me to enjoy, it gives me this whole, full velvety kind of feeling that higher ohm builds just don't offer (other than series builds).

    Another reason is that I'm allergic to PG, so I can pretty much only use Max VG or I get some pretty severe side effects like face numbing etc and vaping max vg at lower wattage tends to absolutely destroy the flavor.

    I'm vaping a 0.4 parallel setup right now for nicotine maintenance with 5mg ejuice, what I really enjoy the most is a dual coil SS 316L Clapton setup in a RDA with 3mg, I've tried all sorts of builds higher and lower and that one is just perfect, the problem is SS gets hot so I need to have a lot of airflow to keep it cool enough to enjoy and the combination of low ohms, lots of airflow means there's going to be a tonne of vapor.. I do only use my RDA at home though..
     
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  49. VapingInNewYork

    VapingInNewYork Bronze Contributor Member For 3 Years

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    There is no wrong way to vape. There are, however, many wrong ways to use high-powered batteries.
     
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  50. Canadian Vaper

    Canadian Vaper Silver Contributor Member For 3 Years ECF Refugee Reddit Exile

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    sort of agree but I think it's more of a respect problem..
     
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