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E-Juice Startup Viable?

zeeter

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Disregarding FDA regulations for a moment. Let's assume I have the funding for that. I don't, but let's assume I do.

Is it really even feasible to try and start an ejuice company anymore? More and more people are seeing the cost benefits in making their own juice. After about $300 startup costs two months ago and a couple of flavor purchases here and there I've turned a "profit" on making my own juice already. Three bottles a week would cost $60 for good stuff at the store. It costs me a fraction of that at home and I've gotten increasingly better at it.

While these vape shops wouldn't be in business if they weren't making money selling premium, I just wonder how long it's going to be before people buy for a couple of months and then start making their own juice. This will be especially true when juice companies raise their prices to account for added FDA approval fees.

Everyone I know who has vaped for more than a few months now makes their own ejuice. Seems like there is a very limited window to get people to buy your product before they go off and try to save money.

The reason I ask is that I may be able to find a VC to support me and am wondering if this is going to be a failed venture from the start.

At the same time, I have been writing my congressman about the FDA regulations that are coming. I am not grandfathered in, so anything I do I need to get approved. It seems illogical that I need to get a base 70/30 mix approved when it has already been approved for many other vendors. The flavorings have already been approved prior to sale. So I'm mixing ingredients that all have been approved by the FDA, but I still need to get them to approve my mixture.

Now, I have heard that the FDA will be lenient in some cases once the initial formula is approved. That is, if you change from strawberry to grape they may not make you seek approval again if it's the same ratio.

My opinion is that big tobacco is lobbying heavy for these regulations to keep a direct competitor from succeeding. This will result in a lot of people who don't know what they are doing mixing dangerous batches and also working with high levels of nicotine without taking proper precautions.
 

bobnat

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The question is how to judge how many vapers actually DIY, all the time. I know 6 vapers at work and only one DIYs (as well as myself). The others think it's too much work and end up vaping all kinds of shitty juice. I've given away quite a bit of juice (usually stuff I don't want) and have told them how to do it, but they haven't, yet. The problem is anecdotal evidence isn't much to go on. However, I'd venture that no more than 10% of all full time vapers DIY. In my year of vaping I've seen the number of sites selling juice in this country grow tremendously. Are they making money? I don't know, but I think some have to be.

How would one do market research on this?
 
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zeeter

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Member For 3 Years
I don't know how we'd do market research. A poll on a site like this probably wouldn't work. The people here are mostly experienced and smart. They know the cost benefits of DIY or they are new and will learn to DIY after realizing that buying juice and maintaining mods isn't that much of a savings over cigarettes.

Personally, I enjoy mixing. It's fun experimenting with different flavors. I can see why some might not want to get into it. My very first effort was terrible. It was like vaping chemicals. After a while you learn what flavors stand out more and which ones just enhance the main flavor.
 

Hillbilly Pig

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Is it possible today? I would say yes and no, you probably won't hook most experienced vapers, but some might if it was a good deal, I know I'd be at least willing to try the stuff. Now I figure most of your customers would be new-er people, like making the switch from cigs or people who don't wanna make their own juice. I don't know much in terms of starting businesses, but I figure today it would be rather okay with an online store as opposed to a B&M, depending on the local vape shops around your area that is, if there ain't none other than smoke shops, you might be better for a B&M. It is plausible, but to make it possible would need good marketing and shit.

Personally, I enjoy mixing. It's fun experimenting with different flavors.
With ya there, I have went through too many flavors on experiments because I wanted to get too crazy in the mixing room.
 

Letitia9

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You might do better looking into selling your recipes and include flavor bundles. That I would buy. Let the consumer pay for nic, bottles, labels, and vg/pg. Shipping would be much cheaper as well.
 

zeeter

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Member For 3 Years
I'd be more for online sales and local distribution at first. Then moving to regional and national if things took off.

Experimentation was frustrating at first. I couldn't figure out why my vanilla custard tasted like butt. My first good flavor was a banana nut bread. That's when I realized you need to have a distinct flavor in your mix if it's going to taste like something. The custards and creams only enhance the flavor. I guess it's like anything else. Vanilla custard itself doesn't taste like much, but you mix some strawberries in there and it tastes like strawberry vanilla custard.
 

zeeter

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Member For 3 Years
You might do better looking into selling your recipes and include flavor bundles. That I would buy. Let the consumer pay for nic, bottles, labels, and vg/pg. Shipping would be much cheaper as well.

There can't be a whole lot of money in that. I sell a recipe and then someone posts it online and everyone has it.
 

Hillbilly Pig

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You might do better looking into selling your recipes and include flavor bundles. That I would buy. Let the consumer pay for nic, bottles, labels, and vg/pg. Shipping would be much cheaper as well.

Actually yeah that'd be better, I'd totally be down to buy some of them.
 

Letitia9

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The money would come from flavor bundle. This would only work if you are creative enough to continue to create good recipes. By doing it this way you do not have to worry about nic level or vg/pg percentages. Very cost effective. Your initial investment and start up costs would be low.
 

zeeter

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Member For 3 Years
The money would come from flavor bundle. This would only work if you are creative enough to continue to create good recipes. By doing it this way you do not have to worry about nic level or vg/pg percentages. Very cost effective. Your initial investment and start up costs would be low.

Maybe I'm not understanding what you mean by flavor bundle.
 

Letitia9

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You include maybe 5ml of each flavor needed for recipe. Some don't seem to have a talent for creating good recipes and would appreciate buying one with included flavor bundle. Thereby not needing to have a hundred flavors on the shelf they will never use. Or you could sell recipe flavor concentrate shots and not include the recipe.
 

Letitia9

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I just want to mix juices and sell it. Nothing more; nothing less.
If that's the case I would see how they are received locally before making a large investment. How many people do you sell to now?
 

jambi

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Actually, I think DIY is a very small niche segment of the vaping population. Most vapers that I've talked to weren't even aware it's possible to make your own juice, or what's in it, nor do they seem to care. They just want easy access to juice they can vape now, and are willing to pay commercial juice prices to get it. DIY is fairly time and labor intensive. I think our instant access to DIY communities, recipe sites, vendors, etc. on the internet makes it seem like there's lots more of us than there actually are, though apparently there's enough of us around to keep BCV, Nicotine River and others thriving.

What I haven't seen yet is a B&M DIY shop. If I could walk into a store and buy all the flavors I wanted to, I'd be in heaven (and broke as well).
 

The Cromwell

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Actually, I think DIY is a very small niche segment of the vaping population. Most vapers that I've talked to weren't even aware it's possible to make your own juice, or what's in it, nor do they seem to care. They just want easy access to juice they can vape now, and are willing to pay commercial juice prices to get it. DIY is fairly time and labor intensive. I think our instant access to DIY communities, recipe sites, vendors, etc. on the internet makes it seem like there's lots more of us than there actually are, though apparently there's enough of us around to keep BCV, Nicotine River and others thriving.

What I haven't seen yet is a B&M DIY shop. If I could walk into a store and buy all the flavors I wanted to, I'd be in heaven (and broke as well).
Agreed.
Just like vapers on boards like this is a VERY small percentage of vapers so is DIY and I figure most who DIY are also Vape board members.

But the competition for selling ejuice must be VERY high.
 
nice thread derail guys. Tbh this whole industry is a cash grab at this point and e-juice is where all the money is made. Your "business plan" is essentially buying a bunch of concentrates from other people and mixing them under the illusion that you can create something truly unique and outstanding which will sell. (you wont) the guys making the most money wont let you in the door and grant you access to the concentrates and enhancers to make the really good stuff. Plus Half these company's are all the same company's under a different name so when you show up ordering your concentrates they actually have their own brands of juice and will keep an eye on you to make sure you don't become competition. Plus its really not going to be hard to figure out what mix you did if you do manage to make something amazing and they will just clone it probably to a higher standard and actually be able to market it.

Unless you have connections in the industry you wont be going anywhere because that boat has long sailed.
 

SteveS45

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Member For 5 Years
When I first started with DIY I gave a bottle to a Vape Shop owner who enjoyed it so much he wanted me to make it for him to sell. But my answer was NO because I am not starting a business and assuming liability for things like Allergic Reactions or other unforeseen issues. Look at the threads that have been created by members who blame the vape for their sore throat or breathing problems!
 

SteveS45

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Sure looks like a great idea, $1.50 cost for a 30ML Bottle but that is only materials. Really do the math with Insurance and a clean room for mixing to start. Maybe add in supplies like sterile outfits and the list goes on. Then you might need to factor in a business license and possibly a Health Department Certification since it is for Human Consumption. Sit down and get a real business plan together and see what you would need to sell to actually make a profit unless you are thinking like a Moonshiner.
 

wllmc

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I have an e-liquid line coming out next week. Will I be able to sell it next week?

New e-liquids entering the market after August 8, 2016 are in violation of the law and may be subject to enforcement if marketed without authorization.
To legally sell a new e-liquid, a manufacturer must submit an application through one of the three available premarket pathways for each tobacco product and receive marketing authorization from FDA

along with all this crap.... good luck :) https://www.fda.gov/TobaccoProducts/AboutCTP/ucm378205.htm#1
 

Moniker

Member For 4 Years
Member For 3 Years
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I have an e-liquid line coming out next week. Will I be able to sell it next week?

New e-liquids entering the market after August 8, 2016 are in violation of the law and may be subject to enforcement if marketed without authorization.
To legally sell a new e-liquid, a manufacturer must submit an application through one of the three available premarket pathways for each tobacco product and receive marketing authorization from FDA

along with all this crap.... good luck :) https://www.fda.gov/TobaccoProducts/AboutCTP/ucm378205.htm#1

Meanwhile on reddit....

https://www.reddit.com/r/DIY_classifieds/
 
nice thread derail guys. Tbh this whole industry is a cash grab at this point and e-juice is where all the money is made. Your "business plan" is essentially buying a bunch of concentrates from other people and mixing them under the illusion that you can create something truly unique and outstanding which will sell. (you wont) the guys making the most money wont let you in the door and grant you access to the concentrates and enhancers to make the really good stuff. Plus Half these company's are all the same company's under a different name so when you show up ordering your concentrates they actually have their own brands of juice and will keep an eye on you to make sure you don't become competition. /QUOTE]

They use the exact same concentrates the rest of us use. They all started the same way we all do. They made great recipes out of what is available to all of us and sold em. There aren't any "secret concentrates/flavor enhancers" out there.
However I will say that with the current state of things with the fda and the pmta nonsense, now is prob the hardest time to get into the business.
 
They use the exact same concentrates the rest of us use. They all started the same way we all do. They made great recipes out of what is available to all of us and sold em. There aren't any "secret concentrates/flavor enhancers" out there.
However I will say that with the current state of things with the fda and the pmta nonsense, now is prob the hardest time to get into the business.
 

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