JuicyLucy
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WTF Juul: Rep was in school calling device safe students testify
Hmmmm.. hard call...which to believe...a group of acne scarred childeren with the attenttion span of a rabid chimp..or a bunch of money grubbing Whores.....
Poor widdle Juul.. Just a victim of the ANTZ....
And teachers should never leave the students with a stranger in a classroom.
And teachers should never leave the students with a stranger in a classroom.
JuicyLucy
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That was my biggest thought right there
2 years ago Juul was focusing on increasing sales. Apparently even to teens.
And the 99% safer statement and would soon be approved by the FDA.
All sales bullcrap.
JuicyLucy
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Talk about stepping on your own dick
Sales departments can be quite good at that. Just get that sale boys.
I am reminded of a Dire Straits song
I was a technical support manager for 2 different companys in the past.
I provided after the sale customer training and support.
These 2 jobs was where I learned to dislike sales people...
I provided after the sale customer training and support.
These 2 jobs was where I learned to dislike sales people...
Sales departments can be quite good at that. Just get that sale boys.
I am reminded of a Dire Straits song
For the uninitiated ...
2:42 hours?
Naah I like cliff Notes version.
I am however beginning to suspect that Juul's behavior was a big factor in SF banning vape sales.
I suspect there is more to that story than just anti vaping.
And that some anti vaping sentiment is brought about by the vaping industry and some rude vapers out there.
Naah I like cliff Notes version.
I am however beginning to suspect that Juul's behavior was a big factor in SF banning vape sales.
I suspect there is more to that story than just anti vaping.
And that some anti vaping sentiment is brought about by the vaping industry and some rude vapers out there.
I haven’t watched it yet but reportedly the meat starts around 38 minutes in. Figured I'd save it for one of those nights it's hard to fall asleep.
For the uninitiated ...
...And your Juuls for free!
I’m glad you posted that. For the initiated too, who were humming it. lol
What I find interesting is that the FDA supposedly said Juul is safer than smoking. Yet they are pushing through Deeming and bans. Juul is a vape, albeit a closed pod system. The citizens freaking out over teen vaping and nic addiction don’t see any discrepancy there at all?
I feel that juul is making a tactical assault on the vape market. Putting themselves in heat to cause a disturbance and strict laws and taxation. But have it planned were they come out on top of the market. Thus pushing out smaller players.
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I'm going to tell you how it went down.
I don't know if it's really what went down but to me it is a logical conclusion.
The FDA came down on Juul hard and told them that THEY (not parents, teachers, anyone that should normally play a role in a kids life) had to get the teen vaping rate down or else there would be no more vaping for anyone.
(this part is true it really happened)
So, Juul decides to send reps to school to try to talk kids out of vaping but without lying to them.
The FDA KNOWS about this and thinks it's a perfectly rational idea.
(this part is also true. FDA knew about the juul reps going to schools)
Anyone in their 30's to late 40's knows how well the D.A.R.E. program worked.
It was a total failure because the cop that came to the classroom took obvious propaganda and outright lies mixed with the truth in order to try to equate ANY substance that a human derives pleasure from as equally deadly.
We all know how well lying would work on teens now that EVERY kid in school has a literal lie detector in their pocket called the "smartphone".
With teens all you have to do is tell one lie and they will tune everything else out you say from that point on.
So the Juul rep shows up to persuade a group of teens to not vape because if they don't smoke or use nicotine there is no reason to go down that road.
He probably tells them that vaping was designed and marketed as an alternative to cigarettes.
Of course Q&A time rolls around and some kid asks "Is it safer than smoking?"
Whatever the Juul rep said from that point on no matter how truthful gets misconstrued into this article by anti-vaping advocates.
The sad thing about this is that it is the parents and the activist teachers of these teens that are telling them they are doing the right thing by greatly exaggerating whatever the Juul rep told them.
There is obviously no video so a kid could say anything they want.
A parent or person of influence could convince a teen that it's a good idea to claim that the juul rep handed out free juuls on the way out of the building.
Who's going to believe an "evil big vapor" rep over a child?
I don't know if it's really what went down but to me it is a logical conclusion.
The FDA came down on Juul hard and told them that THEY (not parents, teachers, anyone that should normally play a role in a kids life) had to get the teen vaping rate down or else there would be no more vaping for anyone.
(this part is true it really happened)
So, Juul decides to send reps to school to try to talk kids out of vaping but without lying to them.
The FDA KNOWS about this and thinks it's a perfectly rational idea.
(this part is also true. FDA knew about the juul reps going to schools)
Anyone in their 30's to late 40's knows how well the D.A.R.E. program worked.
It was a total failure because the cop that came to the classroom took obvious propaganda and outright lies mixed with the truth in order to try to equate ANY substance that a human derives pleasure from as equally deadly.
We all know how well lying would work on teens now that EVERY kid in school has a literal lie detector in their pocket called the "smartphone".
With teens all you have to do is tell one lie and they will tune everything else out you say from that point on.
So the Juul rep shows up to persuade a group of teens to not vape because if they don't smoke or use nicotine there is no reason to go down that road.
He probably tells them that vaping was designed and marketed as an alternative to cigarettes.
Of course Q&A time rolls around and some kid asks "Is it safer than smoking?"
Whatever the Juul rep said from that point on no matter how truthful gets misconstrued into this article by anti-vaping advocates.
The sad thing about this is that it is the parents and the activist teachers of these teens that are telling them they are doing the right thing by greatly exaggerating whatever the Juul rep told them.
There is obviously no video so a kid could say anything they want.
A parent or person of influence could convince a teen that it's a good idea to claim that the juul rep handed out free juuls on the way out of the building.
Who's going to believe an "evil big vapor" rep over a child?
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From the article:
"One of the teens who testified on Wednesday, 17-year-old Caleb Mintz, said a Juul representative spoke to his class as part a "mental health [and] addiction seminar" where teachers were asked to leave the room."
"Mintz's friend, 16-year-old Phillip Fuhrman, testified that he was addicted to Juul at the time of the incident, which occurred in August 2017. The two boys spoke with the Juul representative after the presentation concluded, they said, and Mintz asked what he should do if he had a friend addicted to nicotine."
we do a quick search and find:
https://www.cbs58.com/news/vaping-has-created-teen-nicotine-addicts-with-few-treatment-options
From that article:
"Fifteen-year-old Phillip Fuhrman and 17-year-old Caleb Mintz say they are constantly surrounded by vaping – both inside school walls and out.
"It's just so easy to get, and it's just everywhere," Phillip said. Added Caleb, "it's not really even a social thing anymore. People are just doing it alone, and it's just to get by."
Both have experience vaping – Phillip since the eighth grade. Now they are working to prevent their peers from getting addicted.
Their mothers – Meredith Berkman and Dorian Fuhrman – are cofounders of the group Parents Against Vaping E-cigarettes or PAVE."
Well, there you have it.
Both teens have anti-vaping crusader Mothers.
"One of the teens who testified on Wednesday, 17-year-old Caleb Mintz, said a Juul representative spoke to his class as part a "mental health [and] addiction seminar" where teachers were asked to leave the room."
"Mintz's friend, 16-year-old Phillip Fuhrman, testified that he was addicted to Juul at the time of the incident, which occurred in August 2017. The two boys spoke with the Juul representative after the presentation concluded, they said, and Mintz asked what he should do if he had a friend addicted to nicotine."
we do a quick search and find:
https://www.cbs58.com/news/vaping-has-created-teen-nicotine-addicts-with-few-treatment-options
From that article:
"Fifteen-year-old Phillip Fuhrman and 17-year-old Caleb Mintz say they are constantly surrounded by vaping – both inside school walls and out.
"It's just so easy to get, and it's just everywhere," Phillip said. Added Caleb, "it's not really even a social thing anymore. People are just doing it alone, and it's just to get by."
Both have experience vaping – Phillip since the eighth grade. Now they are working to prevent their peers from getting addicted.
Their mothers – Meredith Berkman and Dorian Fuhrman – are cofounders of the group Parents Against Vaping E-cigarettes or PAVE."
Well, there you have it.
Both teens have anti-vaping crusader Mothers.
ding ding ding....and there we have it...the kids were lying.....or rather their mothers were lying.
But I thought this was a couple of years ago before the FDA came down on Juul?
JuicyLucy
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The Juul in school program ended in Sept 2018 according to the article
DRAT! I am wrong again...
Thanks for keeping me straight.
JuicyLucy
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Still having my morning coffee and didn't re-read to see what year these kids allege Juul was in their classroom
The fact that these kids have anti-vape activist mothers makes their testimony utterly suspect. No one but vapers thought their story of Juuls being handed out all over the place in schools a bit hard to believe?
And how is Juuling any different from regular vaping? It just their proprietary pod design. I haven’t been vaping long enough to know all about this, sorry if I sound naive and/or dumb.
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So the program went on for a year or so and did not end until the FDA started jumping on Juul?
Mintz's friend, 16-year-old Phillip Fuhrman, testified that he was addicted to Juul at the time of the incident, which occurred in August 2017.
Mintz's friend, 16-year-old Phillip Fuhrman, testified that he was addicted to Juul at the time of the incident, which occurred in August 2017.
I never even heard of the Juul in school program. How did it ever get approved, I wonder.
His mother must have come up with the catch phrase “addicted to Juul”. It’s a perfect anti Juul slogan!
And what, Juul will try to rebrand itself as an underdog? Get rid of other vaping gear, and if you’re addicted to nic, you must use Juul?
From what I read it was on an Indian reservation?
And Juul took advantage of not having the regular govt agencies to deal with?
Another example of taking advantage of the less fortunate that we have seen throughout out history?
Probably easier going through the Tribal Council than a local gov one. And there’s so much poverty on the res, these kids would have been easy targets for Juul stepping in with free pods, Yep, history does tend to repeat itself. But the level of bullshit peddling on both sides (Juul and anti-vaping) is nauseating.
It does remind me that tobacco was considered a scared “medicine” plant, and meant to be used with respect by us. Possibly vaping is more along those lines than combustion, though.
I don't what you read but their live testimony is online. They're 100% white kids. There is nothing "less fortunate" about those boys other than their pushy anti mothers.
This from the article linked in OP:
Also at the hearing was public health analyst Rae O'Leary, whorepresented the Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe. She said Juul "targeted American Indians by exploiting tribal sovereignty, which will eventually negatively impact American Indian youth."
She recounted a visit by Juul representatives earlier this year in which they offered the tribal council a "switching program" and free starter kits as part of an implied harm reduction effort and public health study. The tribe was "unfairly exploited," O'Leary said.
That reads to me like Juul was trying to help some indian folks get off cigarettes and that "analyst" is using it as anti vaping propaganda by adding in the whole "youth" part.
I think Juul was part of a "horrors of tobacco" program going around schools. What ever the Juul rep said was probably misinterpreted by said students when mom asked "are you vaping" and said students blamed it on said Juul rep..To err is human, to find someone to blame it on is genius....
Perhaps.
But it was illegal to do so anywhere else in the USA except where tribal sovereignty exists.
A great way to boost sales.
May just be me personally but I have issues with 50 mg nic vaping...
If nic is addictive that will do it and ensure addicted customers just like big tobacco giving away free cigs...
When I switched from smoking 1.5 PAD of little cigars daily to cigalikes at 18 mg I could not handle the 18mg juice and quickly dropped to 12 and then a month later to 6 mg. And this on cigalikes...
Now vaping 2mg or less for well over a year.
Stopping smoking is harm reduction, though. If they’re smoking already, they’re already addicted to nic, and Juul didn’t start that.
Apparently the Tribal council let Juul onto their land. Now they claim unfair exploitation? This story is full of shit on so many levels! But it’s a perfect setup for Juul to take the underdog position with the bans.
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That would be a positive thing if they helped them not to smoke. Hearing about the youth vaping menace is really too much, already. You’d think kids were ripping off vape shops to get their hands on gear or juice, like ***** heads or something!!
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I just have a bit of an issue with a company taking advantage of anyone for profit. esp with something that is addictive,
Juul stuff is expensive and the tribes are typically poor,,,
Now were this 12 mg cheaper refillable pod systems my outlook would be very different.
I would consider that a valid harm reduction effort.
Financial harm is still harm.
And I am convinced that different forms of vaping carries different risk factors.
NO vaping is totally risk free,
Just that some forms of vaping are safer than others.
And safer than smoking.
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Omg, the horror!
Sorry, I couldn’t help laughing reading that one!! Well, kids will always try to pass the buck if they get caught doing something their parents don’t like. But the anti vaping shills are using it to their benefit.Feels a bit like Ye Olde Salem witch trials to me with this blame game though!
And at places like a VaporFi they used to (and probably still do) recommend 24mg for new quitters. It was too much for us, even with plus ohm coils. Know what you mean, we cut down to 12 and 18, and then basically stopped vaping for five years!! It wasn’t a great way to start, for us.
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I forgot they use 59mg juice in their pods. I get nauseous thinking about that much nic in any device!!
True, Juuls are expensive. Maybe smoking is cheaper on the res. We used to take a 2 hour drive each way to buy smokes on a res near us.
I hope everyone on VU has been vaping the more safe way!!
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I am not really pro Juul.
I do not blindly endorse all things vaping.
I try to evaluate the different vaping devises, styles and such.
For instance I would like to kick anyone dead in the ass who promotes or sells mechs to new vapers,
Or sells substandard batteries to vapers.
I also do not support rude vaping, Clouds in someones face, etc. And why I have no issues with no vaping in restaurants, etc.
Vapers are just like smokers. Just because someone vapes does not make them a good person.
And just because a company makes vape stuff does not make them a good company.
I do not blindly endorse all things vaping.
I try to evaluate the different vaping devises, styles and such.
For instance I would like to kick anyone dead in the ass who promotes or sells mechs to new vapers,
Or sells substandard batteries to vapers.
I also do not support rude vaping, Clouds in someones face, etc. And why I have no issues with no vaping in restaurants, etc.
Vapers are just like smokers. Just because someone vapes does not make them a good person.
And just because a company makes vape stuff does not make them a good company.
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Ohh and btw dropping my nic level allowed me to drop my blood pressure meds and to sleep better.
I figure if you want a kid to do something, just tell them not to....I was a kid once, I got pictures to prove it.....
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I don’t even feel comfortable vaping outside; but I didn’t even really like to smoke on the street since the non smokers give you the evil eye like you’re trying to murder them.
Selling mechs to new vapers is so irresponsible. As is selling low quality batteries. I get that people want to make money and all, but how greedy and hard up can these people be?
True about vaping not being a good character indicator, the same as smoking. But I like most of the people I’ve met here (and even at the other place). And the same logic applies to the vape companies here or in China. Smok was supposedly an okay company when they first started and now they’re synonymous with crappy quality control to most vapers.
How’s the mowing going, Cromwell? Say howdy to your black cat for me.
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People are different. 18 wasn't always enough for me early on and I used to keep a setup with 24 in it around for when it wasn't. Now, 5-1/2 years later I've made it all the way down to... 13. I haven't gone lower 'cause I just vape more. FWIW, my BP is fine and according to my wife, I sleep like the dead.
My attitude has always been: Outside is outside. If a person objects to smoke (formerly) or vapor (now), they probably shouldn't hang right next to me, or down-wind from me, and it's on them to move. As for stink eye, frankly my dear, I don't give a damn.
JuicyLucy
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My attitude has always been: Outside is outside. If a person objects to smoke (formerly) or vapor (now), they probably shouldn't hang right next to me, or down-wind from me, and it's on them to move. As for stink eye, frankly my dear, I don't give a damn.
I hear that
And, I almost feel I have an obligation to vape around smokers - whether or not they are strangers is irrelevant
My attitude has always been: Outside is outside. If a person objects to smoke (formerly) or vapor (now), they probably shouldn't hang right next to me, or down-wind from me, and it's on them to move. As for stink eye, frankly my dear, I don't give a damn.
Thank you, Rhett! If I’ve got the old man with me, I’ve got more balls (as it were. lol) I’ll try to be more brave on my own!
Geez, you are a hardass!
