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Clones vs. Authentics

martinelias

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Sorry Martinelias ...I noticed you were responding to rather nasty verbal attack...my bad.
Dont sweat it dude, no harm no foul.
ii apologize as well.
now that all thats out of the way, everyone pull out your rdas drips are on me. And i got this unicorn milk going which i just got today and its freakin bad ass.
 

martinelias

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Hahaha maybe 1/4.
 

pulsevape

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Doc Dave has these sales on his attys called "the fuck clones sale" where you can buy one of his gennys for like 1/3 the price I got a micro mini on his sale at that time the micro mini was 110.00...I got it for 35.00...I support Doc Dave when I can.I don't mind paying full price I feel like he supports his customers...his attys aren't the prettist or the best machined,but all I really care about is the vape.
 

Oberon75

Member For 4 Years
When it comes to clones, I stay away. I dont believe in buying fake products. Not every RDA costs $85 to $140 and there authentics out there cheap enough to never buy a clone.

Sent from my HTC One M8 Harman/Kardon edition
 

whitepony1986

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i have had good clones and bad clones the amod smpl clones are junk the hcigar nemesis was great the fuhattan clone i have is great as well that being said. I really liked my smpl mod clones from amod, i bought three of them in two months tho because the switch was garbage and it would do this neat thing where it wouldn't release> so the mod would just autofire until you slammed the thing down on the table. Now they didn;t always used to do that, they worked great new but after a bit its like the switch just gave out completely. So last weekend said the hell with clones and bought a infected. That being said about mods i'll move onto RBA's, i have a authentic darkhorse and two tobeco clone darkhorses there is no difference besides the authentic looks a bit better. they preform the same now i understand some of the clone brands had a issue with the center pin spinning. i assure you the tobeco clones do not have this issue. not every clone is built well but there are some that are great. to write off clones completely is a travesty but i would research the company who produces the clone before i pulled the trigger on one.
 

pulsevape

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When it comes to clones, I stay away. I dont believe in buying fake products. Not every RDA costs $85 to $140 and there authentics out there cheap enough to never buy a clone.

Sent from my HTC One M8 Harman/Kardon edition
I vape gennys and they tend to be in the 150.00 to 180.00 range to over...if there is a genny in that range I'm interested in I'll buy the clone...if the clone preforms well I'll get the authentic if the clone doesn't vape well I won't get the original....this has kept me from paying for attys that aren't worth the money but are expensive due to nothing more than hype.....kraken a perfect example over priced POS.
 

TangoWhisky

Member For 4 Years
To me a clone or replica is nothing more than a ripped off design. I will not support a thief so I am proud to say of the 100+ mods and devices I own not one of them is a clone or replica. My personal values are what they are...

In principle, I am very much in agreement with the above. I like nice things (preferring quality over quantity), I respect the design process with its inherent cost (feeling that this financial and intellectual investment should be adequately recompensed), and I believe in encouraging innovation (if everyone does the same we cannot move forward).

That said, market forces are complicated. If a premium, original design is only produced in limited quantities (whether due to practical restrictions or strategic intent) - and another manufacturer can produce a (very) similarly effective, safe, product - I don't really have a problem with someone 're-interpreting' the original, general design. BUT THEY SHOULD USE THEIR OWN LOGO AND STYLING CUES.

The thing I take issue with is companies lifting designs and logos exactly 'as-is' and then selling them as their own. I am still relatively new to vaping, although I have progressed quickly to coil building, and a few months ago I purchased a Tobecco Haze dripper - not realising it was a clone. As I'm sure many of you know, the real Haze was created by Vape Head Origins (the clue is in the name!) and Tobecco have copied the logo exactly. Ironically, this even includes the trade mark! How can this be right? Isn't that the point of a trade mark - to prevent the design being copied?

HazeClone.jpg
Anyway, for me, a design can be approximately replicated (because it works) but not blatantly stolen and copied 1:1. That's not on. As an aside, the Tobecco Haze broke quite quickly - the centre post spun and my device could no longer recognise the coils. This may have been my fault (excessive force) or simply evidence that this particular clone was not of the same quality as the original.
 

90quattrocoupe

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It was simple for me. I just use my Mechs that was never cloned. For one, they could never get the clone to work right, and the others were made to order, limited editions. In fact, one was a prototype that was never produced. I don't use VW/VV, only Mechs.

Only clone I ever bought was a Orchid. If Aethertech, had made the original with a fill hole, I might have keep my original. I sold it after two days. I bought a couple of clones and modified them, to fit my needs. Aethertech also had very, very poor customer service.

Otherwise, all original. Sometimes, Chinese like UD Goblin Minis. They are original.
 

Bean8379

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I do not care one bit if the device or atomizer I am using is authentic or not. I only care if it works. We live in a world where everything is a cutthroat competition. If you can produce an equal or similar product and sell it for a cheaper price, you're better at competition. I myself feel that competition is barbaric, but people are going to compete, I can't stop them from doing so, and if their competition is going to benefit me then I'd be a fool not to take advantage of those benefits. And that's really all that matters to me. I don't care about anything else when it comes to authentic or cloned.
 

Bean8379

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I don't feel responsible for what it costs someone else to produce an authentic item. It's not my fault they decided to go and spend money designing something. That's on them. I had a guy once producing machined parts and charging astronomical prices. He justified it by saying it was the only way he could keep the lights on. His shop was out back of his house. I didn't buy from him because I did not feel it my responsibility to keep his lights on. A few months later a Chinese company copied his parts. I feel bad for him not for a millisecond.
 

TF Vaping

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I use authentic mods, especially reg.
RDA's I don't care to have a clone.

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DuckysVapeReviews

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I know this is a old thread but gotta toss my hat in. Authentic RDAs are better than clones most of the time due to better/closer tolerance. The originator usually won't make a product where the center post will spin even when tightened fully. I had this happen with my Twisted Messes clone, Derringer clone and my Mutation X V 4 & XS clone. Now I have the originals, yea you can tell the difference. The caps fit much better, thicker material on barrel etc. As far as mods go, 99.9% of all SMPL mods have a pressed fit and blind braised top while original is solid tube that's been machined. I KNOW for a fact EHPro and Ivogo clones are done this way. I have had both and both top area has come undone. Little differences like this is why I no longer buy clones but save up to get the real deal if I really want it. There are a good bit of clones better than originals though. FU makes way better copy of the AV stuff. To each their own though. I just know from my experience and being a reviewer, I have had authentic and clone in hand and could tell the difference.
 

Whiteshep

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I'm on a tight budget so go with the generic reg mods all my tanks are authentics but at the lower end of the price scale and my Dimitri mech is the ivogo clone that happens to be better then the authentic. If it works and is in my budget I'll buy it don't even consider the argument but I will never buy a copy that has the authentics names on it. Here is the problem though I know three high price mod makers that have their mods made in China and charge an horrendous amount for them they also complain heavily about cloning which is a bit ironic given that it's the same factories making the clones as make the so called authentics. It's not the black and white issue anymore as some clones surpass the authentic original in quality and ease of function. My biggest problem are the people who label anything made in China as crap, China has engineering quality to match any country on the planet if you pay for it where China has the advantage is there are many cost levels with appropriate drop in quality as you go lower in price but in the last couple of years those quality gaps are getting smaller. Biggest plus with clones no more sitting there mashing f5 hoping your one of the few to get a limited run authentic.
 

pulsevape

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I'm on a tight budget so go with the generic reg mods all my tanks are authentics but at the lower end of the price scale and my Dimitri mech is the ivogo clone that happens to be better then the authentic. If it works and is in my budget I'll buy it don't even consider the argument but I will never buy a copy that has the authentics names on it. Here is the problem though I know three high price mod makers that have their mods made in China and charge an horrendous amount for them they also complain heavily about cloning which is a bit ironic given that it's the same factories making the clones as make the so called authentics. It's not the black and white issue anymore as some clones surpass the authentic original in quality and ease of function. My biggest problem are the people who label anything made in China as crap, China has engineering quality to match any country on the planet if you pay for it where China has the advantage is there are many cost levels with appropriate drop in quality as you go lower in price but in the last couple of years those quality gaps are getting smaller. Biggest plus with clones no more sitting there mashing f5 hoping your one of the few to get a limited run authentic.
what three modders have their mods made in china?
 

Whiteshep

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For legal reasons I'm not saying not because I'm wrong but because I cannot afford the legal costs to prove the allegation although I believe at least two of them have been accused multiple times before. I gave a subtle hint in my original post and that's as close as I can get sorry.
 

Skullzz

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I prefer the real, original brand. Just feel a lot safer that way....plus I am a brand whore lolol. Hey, at least I can admit it :p


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pulsevape

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For legal reasons I'm not saying not because I'm wrong but because I cannot afford the legal costs to prove the allegation although I believe at least two of them have been accused multiple times before. I gave a subtle hint in my original post and that's as close as I can get sorry.
do these modders make regulatd mods
 

Whiteshep

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No not regulated mods, on a basic level I think the majority of us would prefer to buy authentics but like clones or not the truth is without cloning we would be a considerably smaller community then we are. As I said I don't condone complete 1:1 copying down to makers names and such but design wise it's the only way many can afford to vape. This argument will never have a complete answer because there are merits on both sides people have to make their own individual choice and accept that there is no real high ground on either side.
 

pulsevape

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The afforadability point is total bullshit and always has been. it's always been affordable to vape non clone gear..it may not be the newest and the best, but it worked....Let's cut the shit and admitt as americans of this generation we feel we are entitled to consume..Probablly since the 50s Americans have been brainwashed into abandoning their culture and cuktural wisdoms for an identity as "who has the most shit" wins culture....we feel we are entitled to consume as much as possible, at a rate our grandparents and great grandparents would have found embarassing if not downright shamefull. Hell the corprate controlled state demands, encourages and validates our identity as consumers.
 

Whiteshep

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Without the clone side we would be stuck with limited run high cost gear as it used to be but now thanks to mass production many more people can get into vaping at an affordable price point and the community has grown because of that. I've never understood elitism in any area but if that's how some want to be have at it I'll continue as I have buying at the low end stuff that just works.
 

pulsevape

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a demand for quality and craftsmenship is not elitism, the mindless consumption of cheap ass chinese shit to fill your patheticlly empty life with is ridiculous.
 

Whiteshep

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Well my cheap Chinese shit is working flawlessly so guess we will have to agree to disagree as we have clearly have opinions that won't agree.
 

pulsevape

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Well my cheap Chinese shit is working flawlessly so guess we will have to agree to disagree as we have clearly have opinions that won't agree.
I totally understand some people have no appreciation for quality...that's why we have McDonalds. they make "flawless" hamburgers.
 

Whiteshep

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I try not to make blanket assumptions about people I hardly know so will refrain from your name calling as I haven't been here long enough.
 

Scy123

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I use to like buying clones cause everything else was so expensive, but now with all the cheap authentic coming out, I'd rather buy an authentic.
 

KKen

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Shenzhen has taken many pages out of the Macdonalds & Walmart blueprint; make something cheap, fast and easy and most people will gladly overlook certain aspects of quality/craftsmanship and/or general health concerns.

However, for the smoker and/or new user, I believe its the only market available and I have nothing but good things to say about products like the Endura, Nautilus, and even ego's and CE4's. They serve their purpose and they work.

Clones vs authentics, well, my take has always been you get what you can get, and if you like it, you like it. Just don't get in someone's face to tell them how dumb they are for buying authentics, or how smart you are for getting a copy for a fraction of the price or look down on someone else who cant afford the real deal.

For me, I'm at the end, and well over the vaping craze, so settled down with exactly what I like and very particular with how and when I vape. Since vaping is a personal thing for me, I want something carefully designed and built exceptionally well by the same person, not something put together by hundreds of people off a conveyor belt.
 

pulsevape

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I try not to make blanket assumptions about people I hardly know so will refrain from your name calling as I haven't been here long enough.
how charming....one must continually strive to cultivate the little nicities of life...
 
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pulsevape

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I learned how to vape on chinese shit gear that WASN'T clones. there has always been plenty of cheap gear that wasn't clones.....the biggest improvement in the quality of my vape came not from new gear, but from my learning how to build.after over a year of vaping on shit geat I bought my first authentic...the level of shit I had to listen to from other vapers for paying 130.00 for an atty was insane,especially when you consider it wasn't their money I was spending.I was called an eliteist and a fool...three years later I still have that atty..I vape that atty everyday.other than me dropping it and breaking the tank it has never once giving me any trouble, and it doesn't look like it's going to any time soon.
I am a craftsmen I have been for 30 years...I don't buy my tools at Holmes Depot,my tools cost considerablly more...I pay the price because I know the tool is going to work for me "flawlessly" when I pick it up,and the craftsmenship of the tool adds to the quality of my craftsmenship. and it has been a personal sacrfice to spend alot of money on them rather than on other things I wanted...Did I buy expensive tools always ????No I spent 30 years of accquring them one at a time.....if the so called elitist didn't spend the kind of money they do on authentics...you would have nothing to clone...it is because people were willing to pay the price to modders for their gear that this industry grew and modder continued to refine and come up with new desgns...the so called elitiest supported them.and if you think that everybody who buys high end gear is rich or can afford it you're crazy for alot of us it is a real pinch and we take a long time of saving and study before every purchase....Is it fair the the richest guys get all the good shit, and the modders keep their production low to create demand?....FAIR is a four letter word.
 
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KKen

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It never ceases to amaze me when people say they would never pay premium, yet, here they are, buying chinomizer after chinomizer, not to mention all the replacement coils they need, then they say its stupid to spend more than $100 on a tank?? These people are spending the same, if not far more over a short period of time accumulating factory pressed monkey metal LOL.

These same people likely see more value rotating between Jack in the box, Macdonalds and Pizza Hut with an occasional Swanson's TV dinner over buying fresh groceries and preparing their own tasty meals.
 

KKen

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I totally understand some people have no appreciation for quality...that's why we have McDonalds. they make "flawless" hamburgers.

This is by far the best quote I've seen at Vaping Underground LOL
 

Whiteshep

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Judging anyone based on their vape gear or preference for it has got to be one of the dumbest fucking things I've seen and clone or authentic doesn't make you any better or worse then anyone else. Vaping for me is a means to an end as it is with most, a transitional thing and if I have the choice between blowing money on it or on my family and friends it's a no brainer I'm sure as hell not going to cast statements around like some of you on what they appreciate or what values they may hold.
 

pulsevape

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you mean cast statments around like,say...elitism...or unsubstaintiated charges about people having their mods made in China,though you can't prove it?
 

Whiteshep

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There are elitists in vaping not exactly news that one and I explained why I won't name the makers clearly that passed you by I'd love to have the money to do it but then I'd love to have the money to do a whole range of things and it's not exactly unheard of for company's and individuals to use China's manufacturing and not overly disclose it. But none of that compares to classing people as having no appreciation of quality because they don't buy authentic or that their lives are empty and buy clones to fill it up that's just the sort of stuff that probably got elitist thrown at you not that you spent 130 on an Atty. Personally I couldn't care less what people pay all that matters is that they get what they need from it to work for them if it's a ÂŁ2.50 Atty or a ÂŁ250 Atty makes no difference we all go with what works.
 

Etown smoke

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I agree as long as they are getting what they want then perfect. I own a few of each, authentic and clone. Some clones I find are better then the authentic and wished I'd had just saved the money. Then perfect example is I have a velocity and a few clones, one of the clones is meh cheap does what it needs to but not impressive and then the other 2 clone are the same as the authentic. Wished I saved the money. A big factor is how they are made, you can get the exact same product and quality in a clone or you can get a piece of shit. To each their own
 

Asbestos

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I prefer authentic gear. That should mean absolutely nothing to anyone. Some of my best friends use clones! (Get it? Haha)
When I smoked, I smoked Marlboro... I never looked down my nose at someone who smoked generics.
 
To me a clone or replica is nothing more than a ripped off design. I will not support a thief so I am proud to say of the 100+ mods and devices I own not one of them is a clone or replica. My personal values are what they are...

That's exactly how i feel. I at one point owned 4 Rig V2's and a handful of other authentic mechs alone i spent more on than I'm proud to admit. (Forget the DNA 200's:D) The simple fact is you can't get the same kind of craftsmanship from a clone than you do A HANDMADE AUTHENTIC MOD. Not some machine cut copy of someone else's art. Biggest example of fraud: Kennedy clones, and no reasonable person can sit here and tell me that a clone kennedy can even hold a candle to the authentic.

..... Would you buy a clone Top Hat Mod?!:facepalm: LOL
 

wheelie

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If China companies clone other China companies and they do not care, why would I care? If there were more hours in a day, perhaps it would give me time to worry about what others do. But I do try to buy authentic when it is possible if it only costs a few dollars more. CHEERS!
 

HondaDavidson

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My preference is to the original or authentic products. But, my wallet is only able to support clone purchases.

So. Is it better to smoke. In order to prevent cloning

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Bstaab

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Yeah I think bragging rights has some to do with it. This would be the perfect example.

$1500 and sold out in minutes

element-mods-BT-5th-Blog-0010-430x244.jpg
What mech and rda is this for 1500
 

DuckysVapeReviews

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My preference is to the original or authentic products. But, my wallet is only able to support clone purchases.

So. Is it better to smoke. In order to prevent cloning

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I buy authentic and clone equipment as I said before. Sadly, a lot of the gear, especially mechanical mods, aren't really worth paying few hundred bucks for. For instance, the AV Manhattan. It was a pipe bomb. Ameriaclone improved it and called it the Fuhattan. It's a much better mod, and about $100 cheaper. I understand both sides of the argument, but as I said, some clones are better than the authentic they copy. Honestly, I don't think they should be able to clone packaging and every detail because, IMO, that becomes a counterfeit good, not clone. A SMPL clone without Epic Design Studio on button is acceptable. Packaged just like the real deal with same markings, not cool. Even if it's just because there will be shady, low life vendors pushing them as real deal.
 

Bstaab

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I buy authentic and clone equipment as I said before. Sadly, a lot of the gear, especially mechanical mods, aren't really worth paying few hundred bucks for. For instance, the AV Manhattan. It was a pipe bomb. Ameriaclone improved it and called it the Fuhattan. It's a much better mod, and about $100 cheaper. I understand both sides of the argument, but as I said, some clones are better than the authentic they copy. Honestly, I don't think they should be able to clone packaging and every detail because, IMO, that becomes a counterfeit good, not clone. A SMPL clone without Epic Design Studio on button is acceptable. Packaged just like the real deal with same markings, not cool. Even if it's just because there will be shady, low life vendors pushing them as real deal.
 

Bstaab

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Ive only had bad experiebces with clones. I own the smpl mod and dog3 rda clones and i can def tell the difference from my authentic gear. Maybe i havent explored enough into the clone realm but im just scared to waste money so i just go for the authentics that are proven reliable
 

DuckysVapeReviews

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Ive only had bad experiebces with clones. I own the smpl mod and dog3 rda clones and i can def tell the difference from my authentic gear. Maybe i havent explored enough into the clone realm but im just scared to waste money so i just go for the authentics that are proven reliable
The design of the SMPL is kind of hard to foul up lol. You got a switch and body, that's it. I can tell a real from clone just by weight and feel UNLESS it's a really good clone. Most clones of the SMPL have a pressurized press fitted top onto the tube, where as the original is solid one piece killed body. I have a EHPro version and after several (probably hundred) drops, the top is starting to come off. There is also the spring switch most clones come with. Mine is screwed as the retainer clip broke during cleaning. Mind that it is about year or two old. I also have a sterling silver coated copper Fuhattan and that beast is HEAVY. At least twice the weight of any Manhattan I ever held, or even any other Fuhattans. Lot of heartache involved in it finally touching my hands however and a long story. I will never buy a cloned mod that has a chipset however. That's Just stupid. Especially these clones of iSticks. IMO, if you want, let's say, a Limitless Sleeve mod, before buying a authentic or clone, check around on price (www.scrawled.com) research it and find out if company x's clone is on par or better than it etc. I mean, there probably won't ever be a clone of a Relik Traveler, or even their $325 entry level Impact for the simple fact that the alien metals and meteorites they use to build them aren't available any less than they pay. Meteorites they use go fair market for several hundreds for a gram of it. Moral of this: Some gear is improved upon or at least as good as the original for less money: Those are great deals. Some aren't as good or use cheaper material: Run away from them. Some just can't/won't ever be cloned: Gotta squeeze those dollars out for one. Others just SHOULDN'T attempted. Ones only a brain dead extremely cheap person would consider. That's just my two copper & zinc coins used as lowest amount of US currency.
 

dingo1799

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725e917cf176019fc7456287680bc302.jpg


Hopefully won't ever see this cloned. Only 50 made, solid silver, hand engraved and no 2 the same. Hits like you'd expect a solid silver mod to hit


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The Cromwell

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Is everyone that makes a Velocity style deck a cloner?
Was the Velocity mini a clone? How could it be if there was not an authentic Velocity mini?
 

dingo1799

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Is everyone that makes a Velocity style deck a cloner?
Was the Velocity mini a clone? How could it be if there was not an authentic Velocity mini?

There is a velocity "mini" it's called the velocity v2. Almost identical to the original, only shorter and has a bottom feed option


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