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PSA: Wismec RX Gen 3 510 is not fixed. Explanation and 510 pins explained

Carambrda

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I can also speak from experience with amps and car audio that a dedicated ground will almost always resolve noise issues in the system. It is this behavior that I feel makes the chassis ground suspect. I am not saying it's a bad design per se, but it requires a much higher level of quality control. Clearly there have been many issues with Wismec and quality control. The added wire is a bandaid over the quality control issue.

To let a vendor off the hook on something like that is purely a fanboy behavior. The rest of us will avoid a vendor with known quality control issues, until they have been resolved. I think RAM trucks have a lot of good qualities, but will not buy due to quality control issues. And I have family that works for Chrysler.
Nobody has been claiming there are no quality issues so there is no fanboy behavior except maybe in your own fantasy world. I am providing the correct information that 1/ there is no real reason to assume the gravity of said quality issues is in any way worse than those of directly competing products from other companies because 2/ the only evidence that has been presented here or elsewhere on the forum is purely anecdotal seeing as Wismec is a highly popular brand so it is only normal the fact that, the more people buy the products, the more people will report problems about these same products, and, 3/ the OP's theory about the wire is unrefuted evidence he hasn't got even the slightest clue what he is talking about, as practically anyone who is intelligent enough to google for "chassis ground" can very easily, and clearly, see so 4/ it isn't my fault some certain individuals are (maybe purposely) incapable of doing their homework on this particular subject and or 5/ are potentially maybe having a hidden agenda against Wismec because, for all we know, you and the OP might be getting paid by (a) competing brand(s) to keep writing up this kind of pure insane bullshit time after time after time. Talk to me more about letting someone off the hook, please. I absolutely love it when you make me laugh this hard.
 

skt239

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I know paragraphs are not necessarily conducive to rants but it makes it easier to read.

(This correction is partly sponsored by wismec, a subsidiary of joyetech, inc)


Nobody has been claiming there are no quality issues so there is no fanboy behavior except maybe in your own fantasy world. I am providing the correct information that...

1) there is no real reason to assume the gravity of said quality issues is in any way worse than those of directly competing products from other companies because...

2) the only evidence that has been presented here or elsewhere on the forum is purely anecdotal seeing as Wismec is a highly popular brand so it is only normal the fact that, the more people buy the products, the more people will report problems about these same products, and...

3) the OP's theory about the wire is unrefuted evidence he hasn't got even the slightest clue what he is talking about, as practically anyone who is intelligent enough to google for "chassis ground" can very easily, and clearly, see so...

4) it isn't my fault some certain individuals are (maybe purposely) incapable of doing their homework on this particular subject and or...

5) are potentially maybe having a hidden agenda against Wismec because, for all we know, you and the OP might be getting paid by...

(a) competing brand(s) to keep writing up this kind of pure insane bullshit time after time after time. Talk to me more about letting someone off the hook, please. I absolutely love it when you make me laugh this hard.
 

SirRichardRear

AKA Anthony Vapes on Youtube
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Nobody has been claiming there are no quality issues so there is no fanboy behavior except maybe in your own fantasy world. I am providing the correct information that 1/ there is no real reason to assume the gravity of said quality issues is in any way worse than those of directly competing products from other companies because 2/ the only evidence that has been presented here or elsewhere on the forum is purely anecdotal seeing as Wismec is a highly popular brand so it is only normal the fact that, the more people buy the products, the more people will report problems about these same products, and, 3/ the OP's theory about the wire is unrefuted evidence he hasn't got even the slightest clue what he is talking about, as practically anyone who is intelligent enough to google for "chassis ground" can very easily, and clearly, see so 4/ it isn't my fault some certain individuals are (maybe purposely) incapable of doing their homework on this particular subject and or 5/ are potentially maybe having a hidden agenda against Wismec because, for all we know, you and the OP might be getting paid by (a) competing brand(s) to keep writing up this kind of pure insane bullshit time after time after time. Talk to me more about letting someone off the hook, please. I absolutely love it when you make me laugh this hard.
posts like this are what happens when you get your knowledge off wikipedia and again you attack another poster. great way to keep ruining your rep
 

fraleywp

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Member For 4 Years
Nobody has been claiming there are no quality issues so there is no fanboy behavior except maybe in your own fantasy world. I am providing the correct information that 1/ there is no real reason to assume the gravity of said quality issues is in any way worse than those of directly competing products from other companies because 2/ the only evidence that has been presented here or elsewhere on the forum is purely anecdotal seeing as Wismec is a highly popular brand so it is only normal the fact that, the more people buy the products, the more people will report problems about these same products, and, 3/ the OP's theory about the wire is unrefuted evidence he hasn't got even the slightest clue what he is talking about, as practically anyone who is intelligent enough to google for "chassis ground" can very easily, and clearly, see so 4/ it isn't my fault some certain individuals are (maybe purposely) incapable of doing their homework on this particular subject and or 5/ are potentially maybe having a hidden agenda against Wismec because, for all we know, you and the OP might be getting paid by (a) competing brand(s) to keep writing up this kind of pure insane bullshit time after time after time. Talk to me more about letting someone off the hook, please. I absolutely love it when you make me laugh this hard.
I would waste my time addressing the shortcomings of this response, but clearly it would be a waste of time.

However, please tell me how to get paid to post opposing views on a subject such as this.
 

Carambrda

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I know paragraphs are not necessarily conducive to rants but it makes it easier to read.

(This correction is partly sponsored by wismec, a subsidiary of joyetech, inc)
Putting all the necessary correct information in just a single 10 line paragraph is precisely what makes brutal honesty brutal... TBBH. :D
 

Carambrda

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I would waste my time addressing the shortcomings of this response, but clearly it would be a waste of time.

However, please tell me how to get paid to post opposing views on a subject such as this.
It would be a waste of time for you to waste your time? You really did figure that one out all by yourself, didn't you? ;)
 

Carambrda

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posts like this are what happens when you get your knowledge off wikipedia and again you attack another poster. great way to keep ruining your rep
I don't get my knowledge off wikipedia. Here's the wikipedia article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chassis_ground
Here's what I wrote: http://vapingunderground.com/thread...510-pins-explained.348237/page-2#post-1859372
As you can see for yourself, the knowledge I shared is nowhere to be found on wikipedia. So, just because the wikipedia article happens to be the first search result you get if you google for "chassis ground", doesn't also mean the relevant answers are to be found in this article, and, as for the other poster, essentially he is only attacking himself─by constantly defending you.
 

SirRichardRear

AKA Anthony Vapes on Youtube
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I don't get my knowledge off wikipedia. Here's the wikipedia article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chassis_ground
Here's what I wrote: http://vapingunderground.com/thread...510-pins-explained.348237/page-2#post-1859372
As you can see for yourself, the knowledge I shared is nowhere to be found on wikipedia. So, just because the wikipedia article happens to be the first search result you get if you google for "chassis ground", doesn't also mean the relevant answers are to be found in this article, and, as for the other poster, essentially he is only attacking himself─by constantly defending you.
lol keep trying, your whole post history shows exactly about you. my favorite when was you argued with mooch that he was wrong and his charts showed nothing. that was classic. Also not surprised the wikipedia thing went over your head and was taken literal
 

UncleRJ

Will write reviews for Beer!
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In one of my rare appearances as a VU Moderator.....


th



MAINTAIN LOW TONES!
 

Budds

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69399.jpg


And totally unrelated......
Wonder Woman called...... She wants her blouse back !
:D

Lighten up Fellas.....
Lol
;)
 

KGuardian

Silver Contributor
Member For 5 Years
I don't know why I keep reading this thread....guess I'll stop now as it's getting repetitive and old on both sides. You both want last word I guess to feel like you've won, but it seems like each last word is nothing more than the beginning of a new argument.
 

Carambrda

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lol keep trying, your whole post history shows exactly about you. my favorite when was you argued with mooch that he was wrong and his charts showed nothing. that was classic. Also not surprised the wikipedia thing went over your head and was taken literal
My past history shows I happen to know a lot of stuff that you'll never learn. I never argued with Mooch. The guy I argued with was just incapable to correctly interpret Mooch's charts, and, in addition, he was constantly trying to refute a lot of things Mooch himself has said in a few video interviews that you can still watch on YouTube. Just like you are incapable to understand the concept of Chassis Ground. The wikipedia thing did not go over my head and was not taken literal. What's taken literal instead is the simple fact you are incapable to understand the concept of Chassis Ground. So much so, you couldn't even understand the concept even if everyone in the classroom told you what the concept is.
 

Carambrda

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I don't know why I keep reading this thread....
It's because you don't understand the fact that the true confirmation of the answer you are looking for is not here, but in tech articles explaining Chassis Ground.
 

fraleywp

Silver Contributor
Member For 4 Years
But you are wearing that t-shirt............ Don't give me any shit about the flag because I consider that disrespectful........
I am wearing a tank top first of all. Second, I find it incredibly sad that people feel the need to attack someone because of a profile pic. Lame as lame can be. I would hate to have that kind of life.
 

SteveS45

Diamond Contributor
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I see you are maturing by the minute. I don't need to defend anything. Are you the fashion police?

No, I am a man who knows what looks good on a man or not. Do you have a shoulder bag or a murse in your daily attire?
 

mhertz

Member For 3 Years
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I don't know exactly how the rules are upheld/handled at this forum(though did read the rules-post), but i've just reported Steve for his dumbass comment above. I like the free tone of this place, but will not stand for shit like that!
 

SteveS45

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I don't know exactly how the rules are upheld/handled at this forum(though did read the rules-post), but i've just reported Steve for his dumbass comment above. I like the free tone of this place, but will not stand for shit like that!

Typical of some dumbass involving themselves in something that has nothing to do with them. There is a saying here.................. GFY
 
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SteveS45

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This user needs to go join ECF so the freaking stool sample can enforce rules he just made up or used his discretion to say it was against some rule.
 

UncleRJ

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There is a difference between Genius and Stupidity,

Genius has it's limits...................

Nun.jpg
 

mhertz

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Wow, what a bitch move... Instead of stating it directly, you like my post instead, as a confirmation of my question... Likewise with your picture previously, lol! Pathetic...
 

UncleRJ

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So comments like that are welcome around here, is that what you're saying?


If they are from me they are:stars2:

Seriously, like the old saying says, "Opinions are like Assholes, Everyone has one"

Here we have individuals with differing opinions.

I flipped a coin and Pro Wismec won the toss.

The Pro Wismec group has working devices.

The Anti Wismec group bought them and they feel that they got screwed.

Points made multiple times.

Try to make your "Opinion" Heard While Not Making and "Asshole" out of yourselves!
 

mhertz

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I must be very slow or something, but I fail to grasp what you're referring to(well, some parts atleast)... I don't understand where wismec pro or not enter this issue... My sole issue, where all my last comments relates too specifically, is about someone states a comment with violent undertones, which pathetically was brought on by a distaste of the clothing of said person, wtf!
 

UncleRJ

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I must be very slow or something, but I fail to grasp what you're referring to(well, some parts atleast)... I don't understand where wismec pro or not enter this issue... My sole issue, where all my last comments relates too specifically, is about someone states a comment with violent undertones, which pathetically was brought on by a distaste of the clothing of said person, wtf!

WTF indeed!

If discussing fashion gets this thread over, done with and peaceful, I will offer myself up on the Official VU FashioRunway.

An Older stately gent with Iron Grey Hair with KFC style beard and moustache.

Wears Biker Boots and for the most part, dresses like a lumberjack.

When needed I will dress in my own Tux.

Also, do not have a Wismec and most likely never will as I am into Sqounkers.

Can we please call this thread quits folks?
 

hellcatrydr

Gold Contributor
Member For 4 Years
My sole issue, where all my last comments relates too specifically, is about someone states a comment with violent undertones,
which pathetically was brought on by a distaste of the clothing of said person, wtf!
:wait: :blah::blah:
I for one still think the sun dress looks hot. :)

.
 

Whiskey

Diamond Contributor
Member For 4 Years
Hi All,

I'm currently working on a review for the RX gen 3 but as since it's not ready i felt it important to get this warning out to potential buyers. I also felt it important to explain exactly why.

I'm gonna start off by saying i was actually sent the mod for review from elementvape.com they wanted me to be able to check the 510 pin and see if it's fixed, I really appreciate that as it seems many reviewers can't tell a good 510 from a bad or just don't want to say anything negative about such a large company. I also wanted to take this opportunity to discuss 510 pins.

So lets start off with what exactly is a "510 pin" on a mod it's basically a generic term for the connection we use from the mod. "510" is a measurement that has become the standard size for vaping mods and atomizers. Now what makes up the 510 pin?

1st you have the "positive side" this is usually done via a plate with a nub that sticks up in the middle or a pin that has the positive wire soldered onto it and has a spring to allow it to have a range of depth to accommodate different lengths of 510 pins. The positive makes contact with the positive pin of the atomizer to make a connection. Ideally you want a strong spring that has a lot of throw or "depth" this will allow you to use both long and short 510 pin atomizers while maintain a good connection

then you have the "negative or ground" side. this is the threading part that the atomizer screws into. The positive and negatives are separated by insulators.

OK now that we know what makes up a 510 pin, lets talk about how it should be. The 510 is an important part of the circuit. like any circuit you want a few things. you want a good connection all around. To complete the circuit the positive load wire needs to be soldered or secured very well to the positive pin/plate and the ground wire off the chip needs to be soldered or secured to the ground (510 threading on the 510 pin) to complete the circuit.

next is the securing of the ground of the 510 pin. there are a few ways to accomplish this

1) press fit - this is the worst way possible as we seen with the predator

2) glue/epoxy - while not ideal, it should work fine as long as the user isn't wrenching down on the atomizer or dropping the mod

3) screwed down - this is an ideal way. seen on a lot of higher end mods the 510 pin is physically screwed into the body of the mod

4) locked in place under the enclosure - usually done with glue or press fit as well but by putting it under the enclosure it won't be able to pop out, not ideal but it'll work

5) secured from inside with locking nut - this is an ideal way for sure. using a locking nut to screw in the 510 ensures it isn't going to move or pop out under any circumstance

1 is bad, 3 and 5 is ideal, 2 and 4 are acceptable

Now lets talk about the importance of a solid circuit with a good ground. You need a solid ground because of the nature of the mods. the mods need to read really low resistances accurate and be able to adjust it's output (especially in temp control) without a solid ground that can't be done. The best way of explaining is if you put a build into an atomizer but don't screw down the negative post screw on the coil you'll see your resistance jump. that's why most atomizers made the transition to grub screws for a solid connection.

A good example of an ideal 510 pin can be seen here
zxrqEFM.png
from my vfeng review. as you can see in the pic the positive wire is soldered onto the positive pin, the ground wire is run from the chip's ground to the ground of the 510 pin and soldered on. positive and ground are separated by insulators and the 510 pin itself is secured from the inside via a locking nut.

Now this brings me to the wismec RX gen 3. as you can see here
Zlh5hXG.png
in the DJLsb teardown there is no ground to the 510 pin. So then you may as, how does the chip ground itself? the chip grounds itself by contacts at the bottom of the chip and uses the body of the mod as a ground wire. This is an extremely bad and inefficient design compared to running a simple ground wire. So lets talk about the issues that it causes

Much like when your build isn't secured in your RBA correctly, it causes resistance to jump around. jumping resistance leads to incosistent output and poor temp performance. Now you may think shouldn't the mod throw up errors? well 1st off it does. "atomizer short" and "getting kicked out of temp control" are 2 errors caused by this. Now it doesn't happen all the time right? True but from my talks with the arctic fox devs wismec/joyetech is so aware of the issue, that they built a tolerance into the firmware to ignore it. AF didn't do that which caused to their forums being flooded with "atomizer short" issues that "didn't happen with stock firmware" i believe they have since added it in their firmware as well due to all the issues. i'm not 100% on it. last i spoke with them, they were considering it. They even made guides about adding a ground wire like this one here
yndNtkU.png
here is a few more posts from AF devs explaining the issue of the poor grounding here
fPUz8zt.png
here
8dSaxHP.png
and biggest one here
eUlyoI1.png
where they say there firmware makes mods worse due to the poor grounding. and they thanked me for trying to bring it to people's attention.

Just in case people don't know who AF is, they are the developers of a free firmware for many joyetech (and sub brands) mods that provide a DNA like feature set to the chip. They disassembly the mods to understand the chips and make firmware for them. really smart dudes and really nice people as well. I have nothing but the utmost respect and love for what they do.

So now lets discuss why joyetech mods kick you out of temp control. It's a built in protection. in temp control the way most mods work is by reading the resistance of the coil, as TC wire coils heat up, their resistance rises. it uses the change in resistance to calculate the approx temp. The reason you get booted is due to poor grounding, the resistance drops when you fire it. this makes the chip kick you out of temp control to protect you. Anytime a joyetech mod kicks you out of temp control (as long as it isn't your atomizer actually shorting due to a bad build) it's due to poor grounding and is an instant indicator of a bad ground and hence bad 510 pin. This info is from the AF devs. I'm no firmware expert but i trust their information. and they are firmware experts. hell they made firmware and a software suite that surpasses any actually manufacturer except maybe evolv and even that's debatable.

So even though i haven't done my formal review of the RX Gen 3 yet i wanted to issue this warning not to purchase it. I see too many "510 is fixed" comments from reviewers and vapers and it's all BS. I've seen people focus on the depth of the 510 and say it's fixed after pushing down on it a few times. it's an absolute joke and ignores what is the real issue which is the lack of a proper grounding. No way should any reviewer have given this mod a pass, and it's a real shame too because i love the size and form factor of it. 1 little 50 cent piece of wire would have made it a great mod

I hope you all find this useful and pass along the information as well, If you have any other questions please AMA I'll do my best to answer them.

UPDATE: 08-17-17 here http://www.vapingunderground.com/th...n-and-510-pins-explained.348237/#post-1857052
Rolling back on topic
 

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